Just read the whole blog post. It was a very interesting read - thanks for providing the link.
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Yeah, I realized this morning that you meant Reviewed not Needs Review.
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Anyway, I hope you understood that Xojo Inc. has a big problem with a lot of professional users.
I think that if you had a big project built with Web 1 (like the IDE), you would have found a solution to make the transition much easier (as announced several years ago), because you yourself would simply have had no choice. It would have been too expensive to switch the IDE from web 1 to web 2.
This is the situation we are in.
The problem started several years ago. Professionals do not feel recognized, it is a permanent stress. We feel like stowaways. We feel stuck, because it is not easy to change development tools of course. But then againā¦
Youāve seen Bob and a lot of others get depressed more and more, year after year, but you havenāt drawn the right conclusions. Or maybe you have? Maybe the business users do bother you and youād prefer them to leave? and youāre fine with a clientele that produces basic applications, that donāt pay much, but that are numerous and happy? As a business owner, I understand.
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I see you have now started to collect the bug list on the forum itself (probably have some 520 to go). That is commendable but what the heck is the feedback system for then. If that is not clearly an indication that something is broken (at the very least the feedback system) then I donāt know what is. But in the very essence of āvisual managementā that is a very proactive way to shine the light on what is not working as it should. +1 to Christian for thinking out of the box.
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Well, I donāt know how the Xojo team does their priorities, but maybe we can get a few cases to their attention to fix them for each release.
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The new category is NOT to duplicate a list of all of your bugs and feature requests on the forum. If you have a specific case that you want to discuss with others then starting a discussion could be helpful to bring attention to it.
Thatās what I did.
I picked three things, not put all 500+ cases there, which I may want to get attention.
I picked especially a few, which would benefit a lot of people and could be implemented in a relatively small amount of time.
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Iāve followed this threat now from the beginning to now and it makes me upset to see that xojo acts like politicians!
We had the plan to migrate our key products (ERP) from MS to xojo and so we play around with xojo and migrated a small portion of our code to see how long it would take to migrate then complete product.
But what does xojo? They let the production release buggy and offer a new buggy release!
If we would do that with our customers i have to close my business.
PLEASE UNDERSTAND THAT WE NEED A STABLE RELEASE TO ROLL OUT STABLE PRODUCTS TO OUR CUSTOMERS.
Now weāve decided to leave the way to migrate our products to xojo.
If xojo cannot provide us with a stable RAD and garantee backward compatibility of the most important stuff we quit to go ahead with xojo for our main product line.
Thank you all for your patience - the best thing at xojo are itās customers.
PS: let me know when xojo decides to support professional development companies.
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They could and they can provide us but there has to be the voluntative Background for it. The acting looks interesting. There are users ranting against me because I told something against xojo. But it is the other way around. Xojo has one of the best concepts for cross platform development. But they destroy all of the reputation twith half baken solutions to say after: it is not half baken it is production ready and the best in this thread was: The users will shoot in their knees with this functionality. I have no hope for xojo if there is no change. That is my foundation for fightintg for a change in the release policy. But: if they have not enough programmers and if they can not move their stuffs there will be a leak of performance in development. I klnow this effect really good. I am happy to know how they behave cause this shows me that professional users like me may have a problem. We develop pain release medical devices, ECG Systems and defibrillator devices. We have medical devices Class I, II and III running Software on written with xojo. But how shall I follow my responsibilities in case of the development if I am at exactly this point.
Maybe there are people thinking this is stupid ranting. But what you also have to realize is that we are under control of authorities and we have to fullfill IEC 62304. Within this the lifecycle of the software has to builded with a functional process for the future of the market time. That are 7 years from beginning of sales. Whenever I need I change the release of the IDE. But this time there is no way to change cause I would have to rewrite nearly 70% of my Code. So I have no choice. Ranting. Or running away. I decided to rant cause I am not the guy running away from problems and discussions. Thatāa why I was starting to rant about.
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Thorsten, i know what you mean and i can understand completely your frustration.
The difference between you and me is that we havenāt actually migrated our programs to xojo.
So why should we go into the risk of changing to a buggy development environment?
Better cancel a project before losing a lot of money.
It seems to me like I have to pay a lot of money for rewriting the code in another language if there will not be a movement. They can not and donāt want to understand that I can not develop under this conditions. They are all so proud of themselves here that they don 't see that even they would have to follow the livecycle rules of IEC 12207. Cause for non medical products this standard id applicable and has to be fullfilled for every App you get on sale with. But in America rules are not counting sometimes. Here they are counting, the gouvernment takes care of control with REGTP and other officals. So there would never be a chance. Thatās the difference between american thinking and german thinking: in america there is the feature rich application the best, in germany we learned at school and studied at university that there has to be choosen always the most stable one. Whatever: I can not change this at all and I see: Iāve lost.
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The best way for Xojo would be to aknowledge that getting a new product as Web 2 to be fully market ready takes time and often a lot more resource than planned. This was also the case for previous dev.
Why not having 2 releases :
One for early adopters of new technology, fine for small, new projects
And a stable long term release that gets the support and insurance needed.
I really think there must be a way to handle the different frameworks evolution without so much side effects (ex. API2).
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+1
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And the documentation when its getting offline for the old version should be available as pdf document for download cause there are people which have no documentation for 2919 release anymore. So it is IMPOSSIBLE to develop.
I would think they should immediately deploying it when deleting. They made the same when they where changing for API2 and changed the documentation.
I guess they didnāt. People make mistakes. Either way, this is largely a user-to-user forum and you should be interacting with support for things like this if you really want to make sure they at least get seen by a member of the Xojo team.
The offline documentation is supported on Linux. If itās not working for you then you either are using an unsupported Linux distro or thereās a permissions issue. Please contact tech support for help on this.
I have done that and got the same answer Geoff wrote to this Posting soā¦no Docs. We wrote an own Help Voewer for the ressources file.
I asked for the TimeMachine extension to be added to the docs back in October 2019 (<https://xojo.com/issue/57854>) to allow users to go back in time to previous editions of the online documentation for this exact reason.
Being that it seems to have such a simple installation method and as it has not been done, I can only assume that a) they tried and didnāt like it b) they tried and it didnāt work c) they didnāt try but as the ticket hasnāt been updated with any public information I can only assume that theyāve not tried yet. I guess thereās always option d) they donāt want to do it to make people upgrade to newer versions and spite the users of older editions, after all, the docs that are included with the editions arenāt always the correct and up to date docs that are available online just before the next release.