I am requesting the Xojo review its pricing model. I would love if this software was available on a subscription bases. Similar to what Adobe is currently doing with its products. I understand there would probably be significant changes that would have to be made, however, i’m sure more people would rather subscribe and have there software and licenses current. This model is very popular and it would surely increase your user base as entry into the subscription service would be easy to handle.
Anyway, This is just my 2 cents. I have always loved the IDE but user population is so low and this language is in sore need of more support.
Hope this happens one day!
Subscription only works for businesses or if you make it much cheaper than buying.
It works for Adobe though there is always the fear that they will suddenly increase the price. Without subscription you were able to continue using your software, with subscription you are screwed.
It doesn’t work that well for Microsoft. Many people I know took the opportunity to move to LibreOffice (quite a capable competitor) or even just Apple’s Pages, Numbers, Keynote. Not everyone can do that, but a large part can, including me (just put my Office 2011 up for sale).
So you could probably say it works if there is no alternative, though Adobe has grown its competition itself (Pixelmator, Affinity) and said goodbye to the amateur market.
What about Xojo? People with businesses like Bob etc would love a subscription as they can spread payments and neatly deduct the expense. But it would kill the non-business part. For one non-Pros would continue with the last version that still runs, and secondly as there are alternatives they would migrate there. I know I would.
Xojo could of course offer subscriptions in addition to the normal versions, or ensure that the last version continues to work if you had subscribed for 12 months or more.
Hope this never happens! Subscription based software is the worst for non-commercial programmers. And after all the trouble Xojo went through a few years ago with changing the pricing model two or three times in a short period it now should stay as it is.
The IDE is the weak part of Xojo…
Very true! But unfortunately it is a BASIC derivative, so it will never be as successful as it could be.
My software and license is current under the present system. If I decide to stop renewing, I can still use the last version under my old license for as long as I like. Just what “problem” are you trying to solve with your proposal?
Cost. The only thing dirt cheap subscriptions do is make the price super low.
I do not understand the stigma attached to [quote]But unfortunately it is a BASIC derivative, so it will never be as successful as it could be.[/quote]
Does everyone automatically think that any modern day language that uses a syntax that began with Dartmouth BASIC, is still no more powerful than “Dartmouth BASIC”? That is so untrue.
A Language (Xojo, VB.Net, Pascal, Swift, what have you), is two important parts. One is the SYNTAX… the words used by a developer to define the program logic, and the other (more important part), is the compiler/interpeter that turns those “words” into action.
A modern language that utilizes a “BASIC” syntax is (or can be) eons beyond anything that appeared in the past, and today the “B” in “BASIC” no longer stands for “BEGINNER”.
Take almost ANY language from today… take its standard control structures and decision commands, and “for the most part” they will consist of some variation of
Note : I said “some variation”, so I’m not saying all languages are syntacally identical, but they all derive from the same “basic” (pun) root… (also note I said “almost any”, as there are always exceptions)
And a subscription model is the worst think I could think of…
Use the very latest version for free, save in Binary format and only buy when you get to the point you need to compile a stand alone executable.
We have a lot of people who virtually never pay for a version any more as they just run the project from sources all the time.
Thats about the cheapest subscription you can get - FREE
Xojo’s is already incredibly fair with many benefits.
- You can run and test your app at no cost until you need to build the app to ship it.
- You can pay for just the app targets that you want or go Pro and get everything.
- When you pay you get the latest version with a year of updates and you can keep using it forever without buying another year.
Going to a subscription would take much of those benefits away. Looking at Adobe, FileMaker, and other companies who move to subscriptions tend to jack up the pricing until folks can’t afford it and then offer subscriptions for around what the pre-subscription cost was and take these benefits away. Then they talk about how subscriptions make the product affordable.
I’m insanely happy with Xojo’s licensing.
Xojo is very well-priced. I generally don’t like the subscription model much but I’ve suggested one small change to Xojo’s license policy in the past which I think would be good for both Xojo Inc and user.
My suggestion is that for any current license that a user holds, he/she gets the option to carry on their license into year 2 but this time as a subscription model. For example, user A (let’s call him ‘Gavin’) purchased Xojo Pro last year and lo, it was a mighty bargain. This year, however, he let his license lapse as the next release was likely a couple of months away and there was no incentive to just immediately repurchase a license. In fact, he’s been buying licenses like this since 1998, just buying them, say, every 18 months or so. But if there was an option to become a subscriber, and spread the cost of the second and subsequent years, he’d have done just that.
Benefits? Xojo Inc would have gotten more money out of me this year (an extra few months worth). There’s a general risk of the subscription model that a user would subscribe for just a month, make a number of builds, and then cancel the subscription. The stipulation that a user must own a current license negates that.
And for me, I’m always current, I don’t have to think about it, I get to support my favorite dev environment and, most importantly, I get to spread the cost to my business.
While we are on the subject of pricing models (and this is my opinion, since Xojo decides how they wish to sell their product).
But in the past, a new license cost $X for the first year, and $X/2 for each year after. Recently this was changed to remove the incentive for current clients to renew EVERY year, when they made the price of renewal the same as the cost for a new license.
The merits (or demerits) of this have been discussed, but I still believe that a significant percentage of us have stopped renewing just for the sake of keeping a current active license, and instead renew only when they feel something important (be it a new feature, or a fix to a bug that tormented them).
If a user had been renewing every year, then over the course of 6 years, Xojo made $X + $X/2 + $X/2 + $X/2 + $X/2 + $X/2 or $3.5X
but if now they renew only every 2 years then its $X + 0 + 0 + $X + 0 + 0 or $2X
just my 4cents
That’s every three years. The correct calculation comes out at 3X.
I do not use any subscription software. That is final!
I have to and I hate it and wish for a once-paid substitute rather yesterday than tomorrow.
I keep using Photoshop CS6 because I refuse to pay for a product that is not mine, if Adobe did a sale one license and more monthly fee to use the latest version I would do if I stop paying I use the version I bought otherwise, I would pay for example for MUSE and if I use one every month I have to pay annuity anyway, it’s ridiculous!
You are always buying a right to use a software, it’s never been your software and never ever will be “your” software. Therefore this discussion is pretty useless if somebody subscriptes for regular updates or just buys a single build. And the math of renewing the license every second year makes only sense for hobby or non-commercial developer.
Longtime ago, in an Apple II, I decompiled to assembly language some C generated application and compared these structure (If, Select Case, de-o Loop, etc.), and it was amazing.
As amazing as what newbie can believes (urban legends translated to computer applications legends) about software.
On the other hand, why telling them what tool you used to develop the application they used ?
Who advertise it have created (build) its application using XCode (or Microsoft C++) ???
I did wonder about Xojo pricing for a while, but having looked at it again a few times, I have no issue with it. I looked at a couple of other packages, mainly for Windows development, and whilst they had a few extra bells and whistles, the cost of a new license was staggering. 12 month subscription plan plus additional cost to access a database server, and the cost as a non-academic was $2107. The Xojo equivalent is $299.00
Whilst Xojo doesn’t do everything that other package does, it is 99% there as far as I’m concerned. The ability to code in OSX then compile for Windows is an absolute bonus for me and is not offered on the other package.
Whichever way I look at it, I’m simply never going to pay $2000/yr for a development platform.
The way I see it, Xojo has my back covered in terms of a development tool, and I am very happy overall with its cost.
Subscription plan may mean that you are paying small sums of money each month to use the app and when you stop paying, usually it means that you stop having access to the app.
Depending on one’s economic status, a lump sum payment may actually look huge but what I like about Xojo is that if I do not want to renew every year, I can do so. If I do Mac only, I just pay for the Mac license.