Just wanted to say...

Having noticed some degree of negativity in the forum of late, for reasons I’m sure we are all aware of, I wanted to post a positive thread!

I’v been using Xojo for a few years now, in the hobbyist role, and have enjoyed it right from the start. I find it very easy to use (I’m on a Mac here); and now I’m in the early stages of a large project which could end up being very lucrative. Every time i have needed a solution to a specific coding issue, the answer has always been there, either in a documentation page I’ve missed or from one of the very helpful forum regulars, who seem to tirelessly answer question after question. I came from a Microsoft PDS background, and before that I used Amos on my Commodore Amiga! I dont miss the never ending goto’s and hours spent trying to work my way through all the sub’s, proc’s, function’s and so on to track down incorrect labels and program execution.

Xojo has done everything i have wished for so far and i know it contains everything i need for my project, should i decide to see it through to a working prototype and beyond. im currently writing smaller code snippets to develop and test the key areas individually, which include mapping and geo functions, a large database which will eventually be fully networked, a very easy to use multiscreen interface which has to be incredibly fast as well as being easy on the eye, very secure access and a whole raft of other areas. Most of my coding time is actually spent on the interface so far.

Xojo as my primary development tool has come up trumps on every occasion; had I been forced to do it all in Windows i probably would not have even started the project.

So thankyou to everyone at Xojo, the forum gurus and the developers of the various plugins and add-ons too. Its all too easy to rant and rave when something doesnt work, but i think its just as important to give a shout out for the positives as well.

No, I dont have any connection to Xojo other than being a regular customer, but I do believe in this product and will keep on supporting it and its developers.

Good karma and merry christmas to all.


huh, what has this to do with Windows? Xojo seems to work mostly the same on Windows … or not?

Don’t worry. If his project works on Mac, he will probably one day or the other try generating a Windows executable on his Mac :wink:

[quote=153645:@Scott Siegrist][/quote]
Still wrong comparising.

Despite on the Windows side, Xojo inc should do better their best, I agree that Xojo is an excellent development tool with very nice people behind it and a very loyal and helpfull customer base.

I do not always agree with decisions and sayings coming from Xojo inc and their team, But my experience is very positive.

Last monday we discussed here Xojo itself and Xojo inc new strategy, and even the odds where against Xojo, I finally made it.

After almost ten years using Xojo for small projects, I still find out new things. With every project, I learn something new.

I do not have any up-to-date experiences with Mac development any longer, but I think there will be differencies especially since the Cocoa change and now IOS. But basicly I think in many respects, it is the same on Windows and Mac. With pre-compiler statements you can adjust your source code for the different platforms.

After a few weeks of hell, it is nice to see that positive reactions starting to surface again. Thank you Stephen Thomas for your positive story.

Good to read some positive comments on Xojo.

I often think about, when I’m using REAL/Xojo, how amazing and reliable it is. Month after month it churns through compile after compile (almost) never complaining.

We should always keep in mind that the complaining is centered on that people really DO care about Xojo and want it to be 100%, not just 95%. But “being nice” takes the impact away form the concern, I guess.

I just keep in mind that Xojo is a small company and that is the sole reason why they are behind the technological curve. However, no app comes close to what REAL/Xojo can do on the cross-platform front and the RAD IDE front. (Although I haven’t truly used the new IDE yet.)

Also, people complain almost exclusively on specialty issues (Web Edition/Security, DB features), all which have workarounds.

If I had to pick the most significant problem REAL/Xojo has, it’s drawing performance, ESPECIALLY on Windows. (Google “flicker” and probably the first 10 hits likely are about REAL/Xojo…) But that proves the former - it is framework-related, it needs .NET support, and that’s years away. Which connects to the “small-company” company problem, which I’ve accepted over time. (And I think it’s obvious that REAL/Xojo only sees Windows as a necessary evil.) However, I really wish Xojo wold hire more personnel to hurry a .NET implementation into Windows, which it desperately needs (and would address the lame-looking Windows look we are stuck with). It’s a sore spot on an otherwise stellar development tool.

But even so, I can create cross-platform apps that people (seem to) love, and that makes ME happy!

I tried this and we aren’t on the first page. :wink:

I wouldn’t have started it now in Windows not because of Xojo; I simply do not like what Windows has become these days, hence my switch to a Mac.

And yes, I have compiled some of my projects for Windows builds and briefly ran them in a virtual environemnt, and they worked fine.

The PDS background was back in the days of MS-DOS etc, a far cry from where any OS is now.

I have known Mac and Windows since day one. Windows was never a soaring eagle, but at least since 3.2, it used to get the job done. Until a bunch of lunatics broke the toy.

Windows 8 : stupidity at work
Windows 8.1 : reluctant and pitiful attempt from idiots to mitigate a debacle they had created.

It may be a bit late, but Windows 10 is what Windows 7 should have become : fast (10 seconds boot), reliable (yes, even the Tech Preview), with a nice Start menu, runs the new API in windows (what is the cretin who called Windows a system using full screen ? ? ?).

Thanks to the inept management and the lack of vision of successors of Bill Gates, Windows has fallen from 90% of the total computing devices to some 35%. Grandiose result for overpaid ivy league morons.

I rather use the Mac these days to develop for iOS and Mac for iTunes and Mac App Store, than for the indigent, irrelevant and seldom visited Windows Store attached only to Windows 8 and over, promoting only new API programs, in blatant disregard of the huge installed base. With all their delusions of grandeur, the mighty Microsoft shopkeepers do less than 20 times less sales for the exact same titles I have in both the MAS and Windows Store. Brilliant for imbeciles who have an installed base more than 12 times that of the Mac.

It is probably too late for Windows anyway. Windows 10 will probably be the last version of that desktop OS, before the Android tsunami drowns them into ridicule.

Yep, I agree with most of your sentiment there. Windows 8 and 8.1 for me is total roadkill; I have not tried the 10 beta and have little interest in doing so.

From what I have read, 7 is at least usable and I get the impression it is reasonably stable, but I wont use it as a desktop system anyway so couldn’t say for sure.

Both MS and Apple seem to be headed in the general direction of merging mobile and desktop OS’ into a single product (My impression at least). I can see some advantage to this. Remembering how bloated my desktop install used to get when I did use Windows last, I think MS wil have a much harder time. Even though OSX is not perfect, their early effort so far (Yosemite) seems to be decent. In either case, I hope it will see both companies trim the fat, so to speak.

I remember when using NT4 many moons ago, I was able to get a basic installation (OS only) with the latest service pack included, down to a tiny fraction of disk space, and startup time was just a few seconds.

Windows 10 is starting just as fast. Sizewise, it is just in line with current software, but with 1 TB disks as standard, it counts a lot less.

Interestingly enough, though, the merging of portable OSes and desktop ones can yet produce new amazing results. I am not fanatical of Android, but with 50% of the market, it has become unavoidable. And it is thousand light years more frugal than Windows. If Google was not so much intent on Chrome Book, who knows what would be achieved by a port of Android to desktop ?

Anybody who has connected a physical keyboard and a mouse to an Android tablet knows what I mean : it is awfully close to a Windows machine. Just needs a Start menu. And the Play Store feels like a Mac Donald’s restaurant, whereas the Windows Store reminds me of a funeral parlor.

Please note that as an older French man, I severely object to soaky, bland and greasy burgers packaged in unapealing paper, but adolescents seem to like them.

Xojo for Android anyone ? :stuck_out_tongue:

I think you are right regarding the chromebook especially. I’ve seen and used a couple; I understand the attraction of simplicity for the individuals that owned them. They didnt care about the OS or what made it work underneath; having their email, browser and a couple of other bits was enough.

Part of the problem with Android from what I have seen, is that version control is not that well controlled in the wider market. We have lots of third party mobile manufacturers who stick android on a cheap phone, sell it cheap and forget about it. So now we have loads out there all running different versions with little or no support for upgrading. Its indicative of the cheap throw away world we seem to live in these days.

Google has a lot to do if they really want to push android further; whether they will do it or not is a different matter.

Right now, OSX is the best of the bunch for me, and since my project can only ever run on desktop systems, Im more than happy with the combination of OSX and Xojo for the development environment.

Just like burgers, is it not ? Not a great quality, but quantity. Kids seem to love it. When they are finished with a tablet or a phone, they simply dump it and get a new one. The disposable 'puter.

In many ways, OS X is less software than a component of Apple’s collection. Apple makes a fortune on sexy and durable hardware, a bit like Bang & Olufsen do. No compromise on quality, outstanding and kind of social status image, which cost more than others but with a remarkable user experience. Kind of haute cuisine.

Android is on the other side of the spectrum. All sorts of cheap electronics need it to have the look and feel required to sell, no matter what happens afterward. I used to joke about that when I sold cameras : some are made to sell, others to be used. In many ways, Windows used to be that. Microsoft broke the back of all competition by bundling Windows for less than $5.00 to any box that showed at the door, including the cheapest and worst kind of electronics. It is no longer the software that sells electronics. Android is. And since the hardware has become disposable, who cares about updates ?

Of all the most interesting statistics, is the number of paid apps in the Google Store. According to Number of available Android applications 1,216,711 are free and only 214,323 are paid. That is a huge amount of freebees. The same site reports only 15% of the total being of “low quality”, but with such an amount of disposable software, what is supposed to happen to unfortunate Android developers who dare hoping to buy a few burgers with their production ?

If only Microsoft had not been busy sawing the Windows branch they were sitting on, they could have nourished and fostered the Windows developers community, instead of dumping it into disarray. Pity.

I think it says a lot for Apple that OSX as a sideline to sell hardware, is so good as a product in its own right.

I clicked ‘Answer’ by mistake instead of quote, but your posting is quite right.

I believe you can “Unclick” it if you wish.

I have a problem with this statement. From what I’ve seen flicker on windows is caused by lazy osx application developers. On OSX you can layer canvases on canvases, on Windows you cannot - so why do you attempt it? Work within the limitations of your tools, don’t blame your tools for YOUR lack of understanding.

Xojo IS my dev environment of choice. I enjoy using Xojo and to date I have yet to find a requirement I can’t meet with Xojo and without flickering.

I’ve now officially unclicked, I tried at the time but it didnt seem to work.

On the other side of the coin what if you invest a fair sum in the hardware and end up waiting for updates you’d really like but that just don’t come?

For example HTML5 now has some great APIs that make the browser a very powerful app platform in its own right, but compare the status of the Apple/iOS/Safari implementation with that of Google/Android/Chrome or Mozilla/Firefox OS:

Filesystem and FileWriter
Screen Orientation
Battery Status
Web Animation
WebRTC Peer-to-peer
High Resolution Time
Navigation Timing
Resource Timing
User Timing
CSS Font Loading

In reality the cheapo Huawei/Android I’m currently using is considerably better than the iPhone 3GS I had a few years ago and at < 1/8 of the price. I’ve had it around a year and it’s not going to break my heart if I have to replace it to get any new features that take my fancy.