Not fixed bugs are not only affecting direct programming.
How many times am I searching for cases in Feedback (e.g. to fill my own if none is found) and seeing a huge list of “Verified” cases in the search results, most of these being verified since 10 years ago and no longer applicable today. Sometimes, I just give up, by lack of time.
All those no-longer relevant cases should really be closed and, if needed, we make new ones with accurate descriptions for today!
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It’s fairly possible Xojo inc. is working on a bug one day and, because of the release cycles, suddenly think it won’t come for next release and focus on other bugs, easier or faster to fix.
I understand why they can’t promise things like that (unless being then flagged by users complaining it was promised).
I don’t admit being called dishonest. Your comment is disrespectful and uncalled for.
I will ignore your posts from now on.
I’m sorry you feel that way, but the observation is valid and I stand behind it.
You are not in a position to criticize on that account.
Your loss, not mine.
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I do agree with Thom McGrath and Greg O’Lone their viewpoints. In the case of the Xojo project which undoubtedly is very big, it is better to have a team of engineers working daily on it.
I think the Xojo team while very experienced is too small. But that is easier said than solved, because, at the end of the day, Xojo inc has to make a profit.
Balancing between bug fixes and new features is undoubtedly a tight rope to walk on. For the bugs, I encountered in the past, I looked for workarounds or try to do things differently. Many times, I found out that I did misunderstand things. And at first instance… I blamed Xojo at second thought, I found out it was my own doing.
Anyway, I still recommend Xojo even with the present shortcomings. Like other people already mentioned, every tool has its own bugs and weird behaviour.
I like to point out that calling other members “dishonest” is also a bridge too far for me. It is better to say an opinion in a polite manner than use offensive wording which easily can be interpreted wrongly.
Chris
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Ironically, this means that you’re calling me dishonest. But you fail to identify even one thing I said that was not truthful.
I have not been impolite nor have I been misinterpreted.
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I hear that assertion but I have never seen any proof of it. It’s like a mantra.
It is especially doubtful given Xojo’s release model that caused bugs to accumulate faster than they could be fixed - and THAT lead to the Pros leaving, and with them their knowledge, advice, and massive contributions: Bob Keeney (ActiveRecord, Full Text Control, Shorts, etc), Axel Schneider (lots of little gems), Tim Dietrich (Aloe Express, Luna, etc), Hal Gumbert (Xanadu), Alain Bailleul (AlwaysBusyCorner, fantastic tutorials, ABmaterials) etc.
Sometimes even DROPPING features makes users buy - like when Apple dropped QuickTime Xojo users HAD TO upgrade if they still wanted to submit to the App Store.
Users even buy “just to support the company”.
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I’m one of those who purchased one of your apps - seriously your Secret Santa app has saved me so much hassle when organising the annual Mitchell event (I have a large family!).
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I disagree. There are many bugs that affect the basic functioning of the product (web in my case). I’m not referring for example to graphical errors, behaviors of some web controls reachable with SDK, but of: memory leaks, wrong management of web destructors, wrong design of web containers, performance problems both web and IDE loading etc… Every time I pointed them out I was completely ignored. This means two things :
1- They don’t know how to solve the problem
2- They don’t care because other users don’t complain (most likely they didn’t notice).
The result? The result is that the web 2.0 remains like this for a very long time until people get bored. In the case of the first point it would be enough to say: “for the next releases we will try to solve the problem” in a roadmap (so I stop spamming the feedback cases on the forum). If they can’t solve them I’ll take it into account, but at least I know they tried and I wasn’t ignored.
Agreed, and I didn’t say they should not address them.
Only that it’s possible it’s too short for the fix to appear in the next build and they have to delay it to a later build; promising things that finally get delayed isn’t good either.
They closed your feedbacks as not reproducible? Or your cases were just left reviewed?
What exactly?
They use a system where cases with higher ranks are getting more intention. That may be just that “all other users” are complaining about something else.
Some of these people still use Xojo and may not appreciate you continuing to use their names in an attempt to make your case again. That said Tim Dietrich is using Xojo for a project he has blogged about recently.
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RubberViewsWE worked fine for Web 1.00.
Since the inception of Web 2.00, I have not found time to work on a new version for it.
In theory, Web 2.00 could use HTML styling to do the same as RubberViewsWE.
I am sorry, I have not been able to get to it yet.
The 20 or so apps I have in the diverse app stores, Google Play Store, Windows Store and Amazon App Store take a lot of time in maintenance and development.
If I get some time, I will check what can be done in Web 2.00. I will keep you posted.
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Link? Because I see nothing on his blog (last post 6 days ago) …
Asked Tim and got the link:
https://timdietrich.me/blog/netsuite-suitescript-sync-utility-preview-2/
The relevant bits:
The purpose of the app is to make it easier for SuiteScript developers to use alternative IDEs and text editors by automatically uploading their updated scripts to the NetSuite File Cabinet.
[…]
The most recent version of the app is in the form of a console app.
[…]
Development of the app is coming along nicely, and more quickly than I had expected. I’ve started using it on a few client projects.
[…]
However, I still have quite a bit to do, including converting the app from a console app to a desktop app, adding an interface for managing the sync profiles, and more. I also need to test the app on a Windows-based PC.
So a console app (nice and useful for sure), and he tags on a user interface (always appreciated).
Let’s wait and see how he gets on with it. Maybe ask him to write a guest blog about his experience, whether it’s good or bad?
Bob uses Xojo daily, see TOF
Sure he does. What do you expect after he used Xojo for 20 years? Doesn’t change that he wound down his consulting business and is no longer providing great free and paid solutions (his reporting tool Shorts was and still is lightyears ahead of Xojo’s effort), video tutorials, advice etc.
Bob used to be one of the most active and helpful Xojo developers you could come across, but has basically cut down his involvement close to zero. And that you see him mostly on TOF is telling, isn’t it?
Pros leaving doesn’t mean they don’t have Xojo in their toolkit anymore - after all, they know it better than 99% of users. Some have switched languages and only fire it up for old projects or something quick&dirty. Some have changed direction (eg Bob).
The problem with them leaving is that a LOT of expertise, advice, brilliant software, etc has gone too. And of course they no longer develop new solutions either … they do that somewhere else now …
I still use Xojo quite a bit to evolve and maintain my current Mac and Windows apps. I am less frequently posting in the forum not because I dropped Xojo, but because I need a whole lot less assistance. I also gave up trying to help after some unpleasant reactions, such as calling my suggestions “lame” and other vexations. I am not paid to participate in the forum but with a polite thank you now and then.
I have to admit that after a bad experience back in 2015 with Xojo for iOS, probably due to too much ambition on my part and too young the product, I have given up on the New API and the idiotic auto layout in the IDE. I read that apparently Xojo finally decided to pour some love into it. About time.
I needed Android, and have found a good solution with another Basic IDE. Better yet, the same publisher has an iOS product which can take the same screen layouts and a good portion of the logic. Quite naturally, I have now 8 apps in the Play Store, and another 8 in the App Store. I will probably play with Xojo Android when it comes, but if it uses the ugly auto layout in the IDE, I am done with that.
It is life, though. I came to Xojo back in late 2000 for Mac apps, quickly found out it was right for Windows, and dropped Visual Basic. It makes sense to go for other tools when needed.
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i genrally think xojo needs a better way to package or integrate components (from github or such) as so that all open sourced items (classes, modules, controls) etc are way better acessible. Many tools have such integration heck even VS code has that integrated. In Xojo it’s manual labour and can be a real mess to work with 3rd party components, classes or modules. Even plugin are terribly slow to load, it’s becoming unpractical which causes more and more work (while most things are accessible and open source) … in xojo it’s almost not…
For example iOSKit has to be manually copied and pasted into each project (or use project templates but that is still manual editing). If instead we could just select it from the ide, and be added automaticly more work could be done in less time, bugfixes would be better accessible as well as features.
This gives Xojo the ability to maintain it’s part, that has to be workable (less bugs = less pain).
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Do you find GitHub comfortable? I don’t. When I search for links that lead me to GitHub, most of the time I find junk, stuff that doesn’t work, hard to download, install … Most of the time I’ve had mostly bad experiences.
For very specific, niche stuff, it can also go. But for main components and libraries of a language?
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Did you actually read the entire text? My point:
What i meant is integration in the IDE. I did not specify to use github for components, only for the hosting thereof. The ide should be able to simply “know” a component url (on github or whatever) and have a one-click add to library. Instead of manually pulling everything.
Perhaps the biggest issue is that in the IDE we can’t GROUP every asset into one module. For example images (xojo_image) are always outside of the module so a module can’t be a one-off thing. Also modules with classes can’t be shared easily. such issues are breaking good component based usage.
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