Can you make 'Pretty' websites with Xojo?

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  2. 4 years ago

    Albin K

    31 Oct 2014 Europe (Sweden)

    @Jukka L I'd like to see some live (pretty) websites that are made with xojo.
    So if you have links...

    Not a "site" but out internal app for contacts and such. Far from done and the GUI is not set in stone yet.

    -image-

  3. HTML5 combined with CSS3 is the only route to go here. You can use DreamWeaver if you choose the visual way or CSE HTML validator or TopStyle 5 if you choose for the manual way (the last one is the best).

    Use the correct tool for the job. When I read the comments here, it seems that Xojo is the best allround tool developed ever. But it isn't. For website creation it is a very poor solution, performing evenly more poorer with shared hosting. Sorry to burst your buble

    HTML5 together with CSS3 is the right way to go. Sorry Xojo fans!

  4. Michel B

    1 Nov 2014 Pre-Release Testers RubberViews.com
    Edited 4 years ago

    @Chris V HTML5 combined with CSS3 is the only route to go here. You can use DreamWeaver if you choose the visual way or CSE HTML validator or TopStyle 5 if you choose for the manual way (the last one is the best).

    Use the correct tool for the job. When I read the comments here, it seems that Xojo is the best allround tool developed ever. But it isn't. For website creation it is a very poor solution, performing evenly more poorer with shared hosting. Sorry to burst your buble

    HTML5 together with CSS3 is the right way to go. Sorry Xojo fans!

    You may not have read carefully enough. I keep saying that in another form, since a Xojo app in an iFrame is a valid way to access a database or other features requiring complex computing that HTML5 and CSS cannot do by themselves.

    I have also several times explained that although Xojo apps can be indexed with some doing, their intrinsic nature does not comply to what is required to get a decent ranking in search engines. So anybody thinking "site" better rest his domain on serious HTML, and use Xojo Web apps only where they are required.

    Reading your post, it feels as if you think in binary terms (either/or) that appear awfully prejudiced against Xojo. Is it not possible to take the best out of every technology ? Most HTML sites, by the way, use some sort of programming language in addition to HTML5 and CSS, would that be PHP, Perl, JavaScript or something else. Why not Xojo,, then ?

    Incidentally, the site from Guy Rabiller I mentioned also uses CSS and HTML5 together with Xojo.

  5. Jon O

    1 Nov 2014 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro Chicago Area USA

    Thoughts like Chris Verberne's arise because people think inside a box. The box is that if you have a tool to create a web app then you have a tool to create a website. WRONG. A web app is NOT a website. Xojo is NOT a tool for creating websites and anyone who thinks it is for that is seriously thinking inside a box that is very limiting. Xojo is a tool that is used to create web apps - it's to do extra things beyond what is easily accomplished with just HTML and so forth.

    People think in boxes. They think Web App = Web Site.

    I have a Web App I created and sell. It's not a web site. It's an app. It mimics my desktop app as much as possible except that the UI is in the browser. My app runs in a standalone and has a bunch of additional features you can access with it that have nothing to do with a web page.

    You use the tool needed for the job.

    But when the only tool you have is a hammer, everything is a nail.

  6. Tim H

    1 Nov 2014 Pre-Release Testers Portland, OR USA

    @Jon O Thoughts like Chris Verberne's arise because people think inside a box. The box is that if you have a tool to create a web app then you have a tool to create a website. WRONG. A web app is NOT a website. Xojo is NOT a tool for creating websites and anyone who thinks it is for that is seriously thinking inside a box that is very limiting. Xojo is a tool that is used to create web apps - it's to do extra things beyond what is easily accomplished with just HTML and so forth.

    Isn't that exactly what Chris said? Xojo = Web App <> Web Site

  7. Michel B

    1 Nov 2014 Pre-Release Testers RubberViews.com

    Eons ago, back in 1996, people largely confused web sites and web pages. Sure, there was at the time _and still today_ sites composed of only one long page.

    I had a friend who loved coding in HTML in a text editor, who did not quite understand the need for any sort of graphic editor. When he approached me for a venture to form a company that would design sites, I tried to explain to him that Perl and PHP were necessary for sites. Since he did not seem to understand, the thing fell through.

    What I read a lot in this forum is sheer lack of knowledge. To people who have never even had a personal web page, the distinction between site and web app is not quite clear. If it was, I would not read so often that people want Google to scan their buttons and webpopumnenus ;) Heck, haven't you read so often people puzzled by permissions and not even understanding the need for a domain, or the use of something as basic as index.html ?

    To people who have acquired knowledge of Xojo Desktop, and maybe because things like Xojo Cloud make it appear as a snap-in-finger issue, understanding what is at stake in a web site is difficult. What ? I suffered through learning Xojo, and now I must learn HTML ? CSS ? What's that ? Permissions ? htaccess ? argh...

    Jon is right about the hammer. So right. Is it not the same thing for people who want to remodel their house themselves ? Most people have an idea about how to use a hammer, they quickly become lost when it comes time to stick paper onto the walls.

    Threads such as this one will continue to start, as people who want to build their online presence need education. Is it not what the field of conscience of this forum is for ? Helping newcomers to a very, very large field, is a noble endeavour.

  8. Jon O

    1 Nov 2014 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro Chicago Area USA
    Edited 4 years ago

    @Tim H Isn't that exactly what Chris said? Xojo = Web App <> Web Site

    My reading of his post was Xojo = Nothing for Web:

    @Chris V HTML5 combined with CSS3 is the only route to go here.

    I took this to mean that Xojo is not appropriate at all for doing anything web related. Perhaps I read to broadly into his statement. If so, I stand corrected.

  9. Hello Michael, Tim and Jon,

    Thank you for your replies which are all very interesting.

    I am willing to learn and change my opinion when I am proving wrong.

    When I have more free time, I will try out the WEB edition on a form on a website I have to make for a group of friends. I am very much interested to see how the WEB edition handles responsive web design. The website is hosted on CoffeeCup S-drive shared hosting.

    Thank you all for correcting me and you are all very helpfull people which I appreciate very much. I regret very much that I gave another impression in my former post, it was not my intention. I wish I had more time to participate in this community.

    Wish you all a very nice day and all the best.

    Chris

  10. chris b

    1 Nov 2014 Brisbane, Australia

    You still need a HTML landing point such as Index.htm Or Index.html. I think that most ISPs don't allow CGI files as an entry point. Thats why you usually see a traditional HTML page as an entry point to an app with the traditional "click here to enter" as the jumping off point to the app.

  11. Michel B

    1 Nov 2014 Pre-Release Testers RubberViews.com

    @chris b You still need a HTML landing point such as Index.htm Or Index.html. I think that most ISPs don't allow CGI files as an entry point. Thats why you usually see a traditional HTML page as an entry point to an app with the traditional "click here to enter" as the jumping off point to the app.

    You can use a redirect page, or an iframe page, or even set up a 302 permanent redirect on your host, and do not need the "click here to enter".

  12. @Michel B Yes, it does work quite fine. Except for 2014R1 and maybe 214R2 which do not run in iFrames. All other versions including 2014R2.1 do.

    The only version that "did not work in frames" was 2014r2. Technically it does work, as long as the domain is identical for the outer page and the content in the frame. It's more of a security concern which we are reintroducing soon, with an option to turn it off if you don't care about other sites wrapping your app.

  13. @chris b You still need a HTML landing point such as Index.htm Or Index.html. I think that most ISPs don't allow CGI files as an entry point. Thats why you usually see a traditional HTML page as an entry point to an app with the traditional "click here to enter" as the jumping off point to the app.

    That may have been true 10 years ago, but I haven't seen that behavior in a really long time.

  14. James N

    7 Nov 2014 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro Christchurch New Zealand

    wow, this thread really got some love. Thanks to all since I started it.

    I have a good solution now. There is a great online tool for building very cool "websites" with all the latest effects called . WEBFLOW And i'll embed xojo webapp functionality via iframe for shopping cart and product search, blog, etc.

    again thanks for everyones input and education
    regards James

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