Amazing from someone who creates third party components…
a “component” complete with source code, is not a “black-box plugin”…
the difference being.
- for those that rely of plugins, and the author gets hit by a bus… say good bye to future upgrades
- with source code provided, you have the opportunity to learn, understand, and modify as you see fit, and should the author get hit by that same bus, you still have the ability to move forward.
Rigid thinking is not my idea of intelligent programming. All third party tools have their use.
Michel… you are free to use what ever tools, from what ever sources you see fit…
but by that same token, I am allowed to do the same… years ago I was burned by a 3rd party control author, and lost thousands of dollars because of it… so never again. And should Xojo disappear, that is not as much an issue, as I can move to any other developement environment as necessary… so it would be considerably less of a problem that relying on a plugin library that suddenly became unsupportable.
[quote=315281:@Dave S]a “component” complete with source code, is not a “black-box plugin”…
the difference being.
- for those that rely of plugins, and the author gets hit by a bus… say good bye to future upgrades
- with source code provided, you have the opportunity to learn, understand, and modify as you see fit, and should the author get hit by that same bus, you still have the ability to move forward.[/quote]
Been there done that - although our guy got hit by a UPS truck but …
Oddly enough his code continued to work for the next 18 months while he recuperated and we wrote new components.
Yes its a hassle if the guy gets hit by a bus.
But things dont quit working instantly and yes you now have to find an alternative but you do have time to do that.
I wont deny it’s an enormous pain in the rear
I wasn’t so much commenting on the fact that you’re recreating a tab bar, but more on the fact that you’re going to stomp your feet and act like plugins are the worst thing in the world. You completely dismissed an entire work, and rewrote your own instead of learning what the functions used are.
Now I don’t know how long each path would have taken, but it’s kind of apparent the amount of time you were willing to put into it with the path you chose…
As Michel said, I find your behavior toward third party addons is quite awkward considering you try to sell yours as well.
First off… I didn’t (and don’t) “stomp my feet”… I made a comment towards the use of a paid plugin, and didn’t not wish to figure out what it function(s) were in the program. The effort may or may not have resulted in a postive benefit, as it may have been quite possible that the end result would not be compatible with my desired needs.
Let me clarify, since everyone seems to misunderstand my statements, and attribute an attitude to me that is not correct.
I DO support “ADD-ONS”, “CUSTOM CONTROLS” etc… with the proviso that the “source code” is made available. All of the software that I write in this category is exactly that… With the minimum amount of “declares” or operating system dependecy possible.
I DO NOT (for my use) use 3rd party tools (ie. Plugins), where the source code is NOT available, or is written in a language that I am myself not cognizant of.
So how this make my “behaviour to third party addons awkward” makes no sense, since in my mind it is two totally different categories of software.
This all being said… remember that most of us live in countries were we are free to express our opinions, and are not coerced into accepting the opinions of others if we decide they differ from our own best interests, and are also fee to offer our opinons (and our work efforts) to be accepted or rejected by others based on THEIR best interests. So do not condemn ME for not wishing to purchase and or use plugins, as I will not condemn or ridcule you for your decision to do otherwise.
No need to get defensive here. Indeed it is your choice to use plugins no longer, for reasons you have explained.
My choice is different : I know the risks involved in using plugins, and the recent disappearance of dtPlugins attest to the impermanence of that solution (he still provides support, though). But as Norman quite rightly said, it is not like flipping a switch. The plugin will usually work for a while before the system or some other stuff makes it stop.
I could perfectly well create my own declares, or even my own plugins. But that takes time. And that is where I am in short supply most. As my business grows and I have more and more products to develop and support, I cannot invest the time it would take for some functions I need. Using the gigantic MBS collection I can solve an issue is half an hour and sometimes less and move on. Christian is not going anywhere soon, and even if he had an accident (I wish not), I can, indeed, replace the functions provided by his plugins, if the need arose.
I will even go as far as issuing my next project in iOS with dtPlugins inside, because I need to cease the market. Time is of the essence here. After the product has its momentum, it will be way easier to redo it in Swiftt with XCode or B4i since Xojo cannot print without dtPlugins, and I don’t feel like investing 3 months or so learning Objective-C (yeach).
Each of us has different priorities.
Well, I sympathize with Dave getting a “little defensive”.
You all have your opinions and have valid points. Where you loose the argument is when you try to tell others what they are doing/feeling/intending. That seems a tad disrespectful, not to say insulting at times.
Markus, you are posing as a commentator without bringing anything new to the discussion. Plus, you are throwing oil into the fire. There was no disrespect here, and even less insults. We are all adults in command of our temper.
The whole interest of a discussion is to confront different opinions. Please don’t sterilize the exchange of views.
[quote=315334:@Michel Bujardet]Markus, you are posing as a commentator without bringing anything new to the discussion. Plus, you are throwing oil into the fire. There was no disrespect here, and even less insults. We are all adults in command of our temper.
The whole interest of a discussion is to confront different opinions. Please don’t sterilize the exchange of views.[/quote]
Thanks for making my point for me. Again.
Are you really unable to notice it?
This thread has been hijacked, unfortunately.
Markus, are you indeed trying to create a fight ? You bring no useful information to the thread. Please stop.
And I have been telling you for the last few months that you increasingly insult people, so Dave’s defensiveness is very understandable, while your insistence that you don’t insult anyone is baffling. Maybe take a time out, then read again what you wrote. If you can’t “see” the insult then something is very wrong.
As for “not bringing useful information to the thread”: neither your nor Dave’s opinion on plugins brought “useful information” either, so “kettle, meet pot”. It cannot be that you simply change your attack vector when someone calls you out on or agrees with someone else on your insulting behaviour.
Gentlemen… PLEASE… none of this is important enough to cause any of us to lose focus on the underlying reason we are here
Markus, I shared my point of view. You are insulting me with your disrespectful commentaries.
I never learned anything from you anyway, because you never share anything in the forum. You have nothing to share besides your bitterness and bad manners. You just steal ideas, and publish them in your column, without ever crediting the original author.
All you seem to bring to the forum is your attempts at picking fights. Are you trying to attack me like you did Brad until he left the forum ?
You are only worth being ignored.
This would be a good time for moderators to lock the thread. Dave can create a new one to share his implementation when (and if) he feels like it.