So how long should 6bit support take? And LLVM? And this whole Windows framework rewrite all together?
Thanks
Well, you can call win32 code from managed code, i know this is possible and its similar to calling c code from xojo, But im not sure you can call managed code from win32. You could create a bridge, but its going to be slow and cludgey and prone to security updates breaking it.
Its going to be interesting because i chose xojo because in the future i can do web/ios/mac as well as windows. Im not 100% sure now about mac, but web and ios are going to be good
[quote=49028:@Karen Atkocius]Sounds like it would be a LONG ways off (I would guess 3-5 years) …
So far I have used Xojo mostly for in-house stuff. While a modern look and feel would nice, for that it’s not very critical. For those that sell apps externally, I could see that i could as a BIG issue that gets bigger every year…
Since Xojo’s main selling point is X-Platform, and I think that mainly is Mac <-> Win, can it really wait that long without hurting sales?
As I said, right now it’s not critical to me… but with over 12 years with this product so far, I want it to stay around!!![/quote]
You summarized what I was thinking. My concern is that the windows side gets even more neglected, especially with the effort that is being placed on iOS. Honestly my concern is XOJO is spreading themselves too thin with all these product releases to properly support and keep them updated. My guess is we will end up with 5 or so mediocre products rather than 2 or 3 that are really solid development platforms.
To be cross platform it really needs to support the issues in the OPs post and do it well. It sounds like it supports the Apple side well, but windows is still and will continue to have huge market share.
Sure iOS is cool but they are already way late to the market on that front. I am no Apple expert but there are a million APPs on the store, those developers developed them on some platform. Many are free and quite nice looking so it begs the question - is there a need for another development tool? Can it be better than what developers are already using? Sure XOJO users are vocal about this because they are already invested in learning XOJO, naturally they would “want” this.
XOJO WE doesn’t really seem ready for prime time, even after being out for more than a year. Add to the project list; LLVM, 64 Bit, IDE Updates (absolutely essential) and all the other resources it will take to get iOS in a stable state, it is not looking too promising.
Instead of trying to be all things to everyone it seems Xojo has some tough decisions they need to make given the limited resources…
[quote=48990:@Dave S]Sounds to me like you have convinced yourself that XOJO is not the tool you need to be using… and are just attempting to get others to justify your rationalization?
Caveat : I am a Mac developer… however… those few apps that I have compiled under Windows 7 work just fine[/quote]
Dave, if the shoe was reversed and the IDE looked like a Windows app, the compiled applications worked like they should in Windows, but Mac flickered and had the issues that Windows currently does - would you feel the same way?
I’d use Xcode
Not if you bought a product for its cross-platform capabilities.
Your original post says you are developing 100% for windows?
For my company we’re 100% windows. We do use Xojo for apps on the Mac internally and for my own use.
I’m on a Mac now… 
I was just thinking back to why i chose xojo.
I was using vb2005 and they released a report writer. It was great looking and had a server on sqlserver. Everything looked great, then i found out it didnt support printing to anything other than letter paper. No a4 support!
This was microsofts flagship dev environment and database server, and i threw my toys out of the pram and found another way, xojo. Im not sure its that bad on windows, its not metro but then im doing database business apps for factories and they are not even looking at windows 8 yet for rollouts.
Most of them are just getting over the move from xp to win 7. They may well miss out 8 and move to whatever comes after that.
Not for windows apps then? Or do you want to is that what you are saying.
I think from what you have said, you create 100% windows apps as a business but you do develop mac apps internally and for personal use. It doesn’t sound like you are or need to cross compile so why not use Xojo for your mac apps and a Windows dev env for your windows apps.
Its not right I know and Xojo should be as good for Win development as it is for Mac but at the moment it sounds like its not. I think unless you really must cross compile I would develop with a Windows tool for Windows.
I agree and I think that is Gary’s beef. Xojo is being marketed at a “cross platform” solution - Windows <> Mac. It’s clear XOJO does better on the Mac side. Xojo as a company has a significant amount of work to do on this, i.e. 64 bit, .NET but instead chose to go with WE and iOS. Certainly would not have been my choice (resource constrained).
I would “guess” many people use Xojo because it was an easy step from VB. In fact, XOJO/Real Software actually marketed on this. This came at a time when MS was making significant changes in their architecture and migrating to .NET. This allowed XOJO to pick up a lot of customers - The product was easy to transition into. It WAS the right product at the right time. It also allowed the ability for cross platform compilation, another benefit, but might not be the reason a lot of people coming from Windows were necessarily sold on.
[quote=49034:@Oliver Scott-Brown]So how long should 6bit support take? And LLVM? And this whole Windows framework rewrite all together?
Thanks[/quote]
I was just going to point you to the news feeds from lat years conference - Bob has a decent summary of things discussed
http://www.bkeeneybriefs.com/tag/real-world-2012/
I honestly can’t give you a “18 months, 4 days and 12 hours” kind of date
Somethings are NOT fully in our control (LLVM and its tool chain)
I think IOS was started because it was far and away the highest request in feedback.
.net and windows updates are not seen as much on the requests.
When we bought Xojo back in 2005 (I think) the intention was “cross-platform” and Mac was on the schedule. As it turned out, the Windows side took off and the Mac side didn’t. So we focus mainly where the money is for us. HOWEVER, there are things going on in my business right now that could change things dramatically such that Mac and Windows, and even Linux would be just as important… without getting into to much details. We could have a need to build a cross platform application and this could be something that requires both Windows and Mac to operate exactly in tandem.
So right now, 100% Mac – that could change though.
I have been developing XPlat since 2004 and found ways of getting adequate results for Windows as well as Mac.
I know of no other product doing that reliably.
I got into Xojo as the alternative to VB back in 2005/6. We’re a 100% Windows shop and I completely agree with the OP. Windows needs a little more love. That said, I can’t imagine using anything else. At least for the next few years.
I think if the Xojo engineers used Xojo 100% in Windows for 6 months it would get a LOT of love.