Web app, HTML, CSS & Reverse Engineering

Would looking at the HTML & CSS produced by a web app be considered as reverse engineering of Xojo ?

IMO no, you are looking at the results of the Xojo-engine and not to the engine itself. Besides that Xojo delivers in it’s install directory a big part of the generated code in more or less ‘plain’ text, on Windows see “C:\Program Files (x86)\Xojo\Xojo 2014r2.1\Resources\WebFrameworks”.

As soon as you build a system with the same capabilities you are closer to reverse enginering if you take their code as guiding instrument. But even then, there are people who read such code as you can read your native language, are they then reverse enginering? I doubt that.
It happens sometimes that people create the same functionality from what is called a ‘clean room’ with their own code and even then it’s not reverse enginering IMO and many others opnion.

Looking, no. However, changing any of those files or using our frameworks with other products is not allowed.

For what it’s worth, that is the basis of many patent infringement lawsuits in the US today. If you just happen to come up with a similar solution to a problem, the patent holder might sue you into oblivion unless you can prove that you never looked at their product or even their patent application, which you pretty much couldn’t these days.

Looking probably not but changing them could end up with unintended side effects (ie/ bugs) which would of course be your own doing and not necessarily our bugs to fix.
We’ve seen that occur. Not often but it does.

Its like having a source license to application (not unusual in a enterprise setting)
The first question the vendor asks is “have you altered your copy in use from the original sources ?”
A “yes” leads to “Revert your fixes & see if it goes away. If it does your fixes are the problem and not ours to fix.”

I don’t want to modify anything. I just need to inspect some HTML elements in order to understand how the CSS is handled when I’m embedding some hacks of my own in a “” HTML container to be able to use some CSS properties I can’t find in the WebStyle class.

I totally understand that these hacks may be broken by future releases. But then, I’ll again inspect the HTML & CSS to fix my hacks or hopefully remove them. :slight_smile:

[quote=143882:@Eric de La Rochette]I don’t want to modify anything. I just need to inspect some HTML elements in order to understand how the CSS is handled when I’m embedding some hacks of my own in a “” HTML container to be able to use some CSS properties I can’t find in the WebStyle class.

I totally understand that these hacks may be broken by future releases. But then, I’ll again inspect the HTML & CSS to fix my hacks or hopefully remove them. :)[/quote]

Eric, just do what you got to do to get your app to work. What you do is less reverse engineering than looking at a page source, which has been done since the dawn of the Web. Since you cannot get the result you want from WebStyles, it is only fair that you inject some CSS and JavaScript in there to get it. And since you are aware it may break in the future…

It would be a good idea to log a feature request, though. That is the best way Xojo will eventually add the feature you are now hacking in.

Yeah, I really wouldn’t worry about it as long as you are aware you may need to change/fix your code if Xojo changes something on the back end at some point. I inspect elements and overwrite the css all the time for my WebProjects. It’s pretty necessary with CSS until Xojo one day fixes the web-styles debacle. Even the locking and positioning is very constraining when you want layout content to flow automatically with resizing. I know the web framework will get there eventually but its not been getting the love and attention it deserves with all the iOS and 64bit stuff going on. I’ve heard autolayout and the new framework are coming to Web next after iOS so hopefully then these things will be addressed.