[quote=36021:@Lynn Fredricks]We take your comments seriously and they are appreciated. I’ve been reading through all the comments here. We are working on a new site and Id like us to proactively deal with these things on design rather than re-design.
I get the downloads issue especially and the license tracking. For downloads, its all “Valentina for X” rather than DB or Reports. That’s fixable one way or the other, in that Valentina for Xojo contains both sets of components for the specific platform- reports and db - perhaps that just needs better identification, ie Valentina ADK for Xojo for Mac installer installs both reports and db components.[/quote]
Lynn, this is not only for Xojo.
Valentina for LiveCode
Valentina for Dirctor
Valentina for NET
and even Valentina Studio with Valentina Server
all and each our products contains DB and Reports in same time.
We do not have separate archives of DB Server and Report Server. Its single archive. Its single executable.
You need download
a) Valentina Studio - to design reports..........................................................................{Choose OS/arch} <DOWNLOAD LINK>
b) Valentina Server - IF you want use it........................................................................ {Choose OS/arch} <DOWNLOAD LINK>
c) Report ADK......................................................................... {Choose Environment} {Choose OS/arch} <DOWNLOAD LINK>
But will make things more obvious. Right.
Hmm, may be it is possible yet, to generate on the fly bash/batch script, which will download archives and install according to choices. This requires CLICK + run in terminal… although still installers will ask for confirmations …
I"m in the US. Tried again and it was blazing fast. This is the outlier data point though. I’ve had issues with downloading from your site since last week. Often they just timed out.
Wow. I just read this entire thread twice, and I still don’t understand the licensing scheme / requirements. What do I have to purchase in order to develop and distribute an unlimited number of copies of an unlimited number of desktop apps each containing a locally embedded single user database, with reporting?
For local database (only) application, Valentina DB ADK for Xojo (select platforms). Unlimited, royalty free distribution.
For local reports (only) application, Valentina Reports ADK for Xojo (select platforms). Unlimited, royalty free distribution ( all three included in Omegabundle for Xojo 2013!) If you want this with Valentina DB, you need also Valentina DB ADK for Xojo. If you are using it with SQLite, then you just need Valentina Reports ADK for Xojo.
If you want client / server with deployable Valentina Server with 5 connections, then Valentina Developer Network. If you have this, you can get higher capacity versions of Server at a deep discount. Server includes both Valentina DB native as a database server and Reports as a server (that works with MySQL, Postgre, too).
There’s an announcement tomorrow for Omegabundle for Xojo 2013 (the larger one) regarding some additional benefits if you are interested in Valentina DB.
I’m probably not the best person to answer this but from what I gather you’re going to need:
Valentina Database ADK
Valentina Reports ADK
Valentina Studio Pro (to create the reports)
So if you’re wanting cross platform you’re looking at 399.99 for the database, 399.99 for the Reports, and 199.99 for the Software that makes the reports. Grand total $999.97
I really hope I’m wrong about this but it explains helps explain why adoption is so low.
And there isn’t an Omegabundle to help you out either. The regular bundle has the server and the mini is just one platform.
The store also has an ALL. Not sure what that is but it’s more expensive. I was operating under the assumption that DB 3 meant all three platforms. That might be an incorrect inference.
[quote=36223:@Joseph Claeys]I’m probably not the best person to answer this but from what I gather you’re going to need:
Valentina Database ADK
Valentina Reports ADK
Valentina Studio Pro (to create the reports)
So if you’re wanting cross platform you’re looking at 399.99 for the database, 399.99 for the Reports, and 199.99 for the Software that makes the reports. Grand total $999.97
[/quote]
Very correct.
[quote=36223:@Joseph Claeys]I really hope I’m wrong about this but it explains helps explain why adoption is so low.
And there isn’t an Omegabundle to help you out either. The regular bundle has the server and the mini is just one platform.[/quote]
You mean price is too high?
OmegaBundle 2012 did include all that: DB ADK - 3 OS, Report ADK - 3 OS, VStudio RPO - 1 OS, and even VServer INFINITY
OmegaBundle 2013 includes Report ADK - 3 OS, VStudio RPO - 5 copies!!, and even VServer INFINITY
And above Lynn says about nice surprise tomorrow for OB-2013.
So in fact, with OB-2012 and OB-2013 you get practically all Valentina products, which a Xojo developer may want (except VDN).
Grand Total products included into OB is: 399 + 399 + (5 * 200) + 1500 = $3,300
And you get yet other great plugins from other vendors.
Remember that if you’re creating a desktop application with Xojo then Valentina is competing with free. So $399 for the cross-platform database is $399 more expensive than using SQLite. So for $150 Chay could grab BKeeney Shorts and have an extra $849.97 in his pocket to buy everyone a round of beer at the next Xojo Conference.
In my situation I’m using SQLite for a webapplication. It’s suboptimal. I need to either optimize some things or move to a better way of handling the data. That’s why I started down this road of investigating Valentina. If I decided to use the Valentina ADK (without the server) I would still have to get the $399 version because I develop on a Mac but my server is Linux. I don’t think I could test my app without having a Mac version. Unless I’m mistaken.
[quote=36243:@Joseph Claeys]Remember that if you’re creating a desktop application with Xojo then Valentina is competing with free. So $399 for the cross-platform database is $399 more expensive than using SQLite. So for $150 Chay could grab BKeeney Shorts and have an extra $849.97 in his pocket to buy everyone a round of beer at the next Xojo Conference.
[/quote]
Don’t know how long you are with RB/Xojo. Let me remind, that about 5-7 years ago, SQLite plugins for RB did cost 150$, then they have start compete to each other. go down. Then RB itself included sqlite.
If you happy with SQLite, its up to you. If you want to make your app x10 times faster you may consider Valentina DB. On our site exists few testimonials that compare sqlite/coreData to Valentina.
With all respect, shorts – is not competitor to Valentina Reports in any way. I even do not very understand, why somebody may decide to pay for this money. You can take any DRAW Library and draw report in similar way. Draw Line(x,y), Draw Text(x, y) …
How you can compare shorts to Valentina Studio’s Report Editor?? To Valentina Report Server??
Have you ever see prices of other report Servers?
Crystall Reports 5 connections - near to 3000$, 25 connections - 16,000$
with nice text: The DevExpress Report Server won’t break your IT budget. You can purchase it with 15 Client Access Licenses for only $1999.99 a fraction of the cost when compared with similar products.
Guys! We give to everybody Valentina DB + Reports Server with 5 connections for FREE. Take and use!
Crystall reports Server - 5 connections, again from 3000$, and Windows only.
So when you point me ZERO prices, I can point you much much higher level of prices on similar products, which are not so cross-platform.
Do you even realize what hard tasks we resolve here to make working products on 3 OS?
Above Windows-only products even do not try resolve such troubles… We do…
[quote=36243:@Joseph Claeys]In my situation I’m using SQLite for a webapplication. It’s suboptimal. I need to either optimize some things or move to a better way of handling the data. That’s why I started down this road of investigating Valentina. If I decided to use the Valentina ADK (without the server) I would still have to get the $399 version because I develop on a Mac but my server is Linux. I don’t think I could test my app without having a Mac version. Unless I’m mistaken.
[/quote]
Joseph, important question to you. Your web application is for in-house use? or you going deploy it (sale?) to 100-1000 customers?
Anyway, you can replace FREE SQLite, by FREE VServer/5. In both cases.
What troubles you see on this way? You replace a single-user db engine, on ‘DB Server + REPORT Server with 5 connections’.
It is FREE.
I do not see any advantage for you to use Valentina DB ADK for your WEB App.
You say: “my linux server”, sounds like you will have only one copy of that WebApp. i.e. you not need deploy it.
right?
I was just using that make an apples to apples comparison.
True. That’s why I’m still reading up on Valentina.
[quote=36251:@Ruslan Zasukhin]You say: “my linux server”, sounds like you will have only one copy of that WebApp. i.e. you not need deploy it. right?
[/quote]
Ruslan, I bought Valentina Studio with the last Omega bundle and found it quite unstable. Using the diagramm editor for creating an ERM diagramm it was impossible to create an n:m connection between two entities without crashing the wholie application. It is possible to create a connection entity and use two 1:n connections as a workaround, it is an awkward solution though.
Each separate issue report into separate issue report.
If you have database or project then attach it compressed to the report.
you can put up to 250Kb archives.
Provide in the report as many detailed info as you can: OS, version, locale, .
If possible, please provide exact steps how to reproduce problem.
=========================================
In other words, please teach us how to reproduce.
Also on the next start vstudio offer you send crash log.
You can specify “send contact info” then we will see also that crash is from your.
Also in mantis you will be asked about which exactly DB you using, and so on
M:M can be a) Binary Link MM if you work with Valentina DB, b) third MM table for other relational DBs.
Also there are different ways to create such link on diagram. You can start link between two tables without KEY fields at all, they will be automatically added. Or they can exists already. What is your case?
We need to know all this info.
As only we can reproduce, usually it takes few hours, and build with fix in 1-2 days.
The same could be said for all free alternatives for X (fill in with whatever app you need, there are lots of them). It is not an easy thing to compete with free, but we’ve been doing it for a long time now. The secret is to make a product that’s worth paying for, and to make clear that a lot of products that are free to download can end up costing you a lot.
It can cost you because some awesome features have not been incorporated into the free solution; your competitor may decide to use the non-free solution - turning those awesome features into their features.
It can cost you because the non-free version comes with support that’s timely and specific, and likely included in the base cost. When we get a bug report that we can duplicate, generally speaking it isn’t hard to find out when its going to get fixed. Many of those free solutions do make their source code available; if you are really, really good at it, you can fix that yourself. Or you can pay someone else a lot of money to fix the problem. Or you can pray that it gets addressed in the next update.
Im not knocking FOSS. I love me some projects too. But the F part doesn’t begin to address the real costs of development.
