Real Studio 2012r2.1 issues in High Sierra (10.13)

Because you asked for solutions or workarounds, and, your choices being quite limited, Thomas presented a reasonable one. “Thanks” would have been the appropriate response for the time he took to think about and post that, whether it’s useful to you personally or not.

Just saying.

@Thomas Tempelmann - have you tried resetting your system volume back to HFS+ instead of APFS? It may be that simple.

[quote=352989:@Thomas Tempelmann]I just noticed that when I try to add any control to a window of a Desktop project in Real Studio, running on macOS 10.13, they all end up invisible, with a negative Top and Zero Height. Tried on two computers.
Does anyone have a solution or does it work for someone in 10.13?[/quote]
I just tried with REAL Studio 2011r3 and a new, empty Desktop project. I’ve added a couple of Controls and they show up both in the IDE and in a DebugRun.
So I wonder what the issue is or how to reproduce it on my MacBook Pro running 10.13.3?
Ah, the title is about REAL Studio 2012r2.1… I don’t have that installed - but maybe you have a 2011r3 around? And if yes - is that version any different for you?

It took me a while to understand what you and Thomas Eckert meant - you made the assumption that I’m already on 10.13 and now cannot use the old IDE any more, and was looking for a solution.

Well, it isn’t like that. I was only looking for a solution on making the old IDE work on 10.13, not to get back to 10.12 - I’ve been around long enough to know not to run only one system and then having no way to go back :wink:

My apologies for not having explained my question well enough and not understanding what Thomas meant - my reaction to Thomas’ suggestion was pure bafflement - I really didn’t understand why he was suggesting to upgrade to 10.13 and then using a VM when I could just stay with 10.12, hence my question why I should do that, assuming Thomas meant something I didn’t realize.

Thanks, I’ll give that a try. I should have a backup of that version around somewhere.

I just ran 2012r2.1 on my Mac Pro canister with 10.13.4 and no issues.

Tim, you think the issue is with older macOS version (10.3.2 or 10.3.3) and 10.13.4 is the ‘fix’?

I’m currently running 10.13.3. And creating a quick-and-dirty HelloWorld was no issue with 2011r3. But I haven’t tried any bigger/existing projects, since my working machine is still on 10.12.x.
But yes, it would be nice to know if Thomas has a 10.13.1-2, and if the issue I’m not seeing with 2011r3 has been fixed with 10.13.3.

Not necessarily - I just ran 2012r2.1 on my MBP running 10.13.2.

I can reproduce the issue on 10.13.3. Simply start a new desktop prj, and drag a Label into the window editor - boom, it vanishes in the negative x/y space.
Installing 10.13.4b2 now…

I completely take this back - 2012r2.1 is a total mess on 10.13.3 AND 10.13.4b2. It’s seems fine with an existing project, but a new project is all over the place.

However, I don’t expect this to be a big one on Xojo’s plate since they have no way of determining what a Mac OS version is going to do from one release to the next, let alone 6 years into the future …

Interesting… today I’m having the same issue. That’s really odd - since I haven’t changed much on this machine since last time where it worked just fine.
Anyway - is this “drag-a-Control into the Window Editor” your only issue? It seems to me that if you double-click the Control in the “Control-Library (on the left)”, it gets positioned in a visible place in the Window Editor, and from there you can drag it to where you want it to be.

[quote=353039:@Thomas Tempelmann]Here’s a list of things that do not work for me well in the Xojo IDE:
Every time I Debug, the right pane (showing properties and such) gets in the way of the debugger’s right half, covering up the values it’s showing. This, for instance, only happens for me because I do not use the IDE in full screen mode, usually, so my IDE window is fairly small. Those who always keep it at a width of 1920 px will probably never notice. Regardless, the right Props pane should not even be shown in Debugger mode, because it’s quite useless there. But me trying to convince Xojo to fix this? Like fighting windmills, it feels.[/quote]

This one (if it’s the same issue I reported) is now marked as Fixed and Verified:

<https://xojo.com/issue/51027>

Consistently? I believe that when I tried this back then, every time I dragged a ctrl around inside a window, it would move off-view. Meaning I had to change the Top/Left property values instead to move the ctrls.

Actually, I just tried this again in 10.13.4, and I can confirm what Jürg Otter suggested: Double clicking controls instead of dragging them into the window works - after that I can drag them inside the window without trouble. I think I can live with that.

The other problem with the old IDE, one that already exists in 10.12 (and maybe in 10.11, I don’t remember), is that sample code in the Language Ref window does not appear any more - but I can work around that by selecting the text and copying it to an editor.

My biggest gripe with the current IDE is simply that it makes my workflow less efficient that it did with the previous IDE (and that one made it somewhat less efficient that the even earlier IDE). Having to click more and more for often-repeated tasks (and especially if there are not kbd shortcuts for it) is really annoying to me. Examples are not only that I have to click more often to open the sub-sections in the left browser pane (I had suggested to at least support the “alt” key for opening all deeper level at once, which was constantly ignored, even though implementing that would’ve been quite easy), and the fact that I cannot often use the Tab key any more to get to all the fields - I have to switch to use the mouse to point to the fields more often, all of which should not be necessary if the design would’ve been thought trough better in regards to keep the IDE efficient for a fast-working programmer.

Favor? Could anyone test 2011R3 as well? That’s my go-to version when I need a quick single-file-EXE build.

I don’t have 2011r3, but in 2011r4.3, double-clicking on a control puts in within the window, with its default Height value. But in all versions of RS I’ve tried under High Sierra, even if you drag a control into a window and it goes off into negative Y with zero height, it’s really not a huge deal to manually type in new values for Top and Height.