Lost am I

So having just renewed my Xojo license I can now develop for the iOS platform. I’ve added a mac mini & two 24" screens to my desk. The screens are rotated 90 degrees which actually works well with the iOS screen configuration. My Xojo configuration is to have floating pallets for the inspector & library. Again this works well I’m able to get both pallets on the left of the main screen (inspector at the top), while the other (left) screen has the project.

But when I open a new project I need to move the window to the left screen & expand it’s size to fit and open the Inspector & Library pallets. Is this just what I need to get used to or is there a solution that works?

I’ll admit I’m a Windows dude, and quite frankly so far I can’t see why anyone would chose Mac. But I am able to be reformed with guidance!

[quote=187312:@Wayne Golding]So having just renewed my Xojo license I can now develop for the iOS platform. I’ve added a mac mini & two 24" screens to my desk. The screens are rotated 90 degrees which actually works well with the iOS screen configuration. My Xojo configuration is to have floating pallets for the inspector & library. Again this works well I’m able to get both pallets on the left of the main screen (inspector at the top), while the other (left) screen has the project.

But when I open a new project I need to move the window to the left screen & expand it’s size to fit and open the Inspector & Library pallets. Is this just what I need to get used to or is there a solution that works?

I’ll admit I’m a Windows dude, and quite frankly so far I can’t see why anyone would chose Mac. But I am able to be reformed with guidance![/quote]

Norman Palardy, famous multi screen virtuoso and Mac connoisseur, will no doubt be able to help. Being myself multi machines but no multi screen, I would not venture hypothesizing :wink:

I just wanted to bid you welcome to the enchanted world of iOS, where indirect execution makes things so fun. Especially with the new framework that does away with so many familiar things, first in line being String replaced by Text. You will no doubt have questions, and I am sure with the assistance of the nascent iOS Xojo developers community you will soon feel very comfortable.

Xojo iOS is still a bit young and does not have the full compliment of controls. There are solutions, though, to expand the current version, a bit like WFS.

See https://github.com/kingj5/iOSKit for the iOSKit series of classes by Jason King See https://github.com/sbeardsl/xojoGestures for a module from Stephen J. Beardslee which brings gesture support. See https://github.com/UBogun/Xojo-iosLib from Ulrich Bogun for extended modules and classes.

And if you need to reuse existing code, I published a wrapper I used myself for that, which provides access to a collection of methods that mimic the traditional Xojo. I have no doubt you could do it yourself, but as it is already done…
https://github.com/Mitchboo/XojoiOSWrapper

Hey Michel,

It’s not the developing of iOS that’s get’s me it’s the OSX part.

I have seen the libraries that you have linked to & the bits I use don’t work. In particular EncodeBase64/DecodeBase64, EncodeURL. I have implemented my own versions (native Xojo) that do work with the API supplier I’m using.

However it still comes down to OSX sucks! I can use it, but oh after Windows why would you bother?

Hopefully NORM will give me guidance.

Cheers mate!

I see what you mean. I believe it’s rather a task for a feedback request: “Make Xojo OSX’s floating palettes multi-window capable”. Currently they are always placed on screen 0 it seems. A Mac can handle window positions over multiple screens of course :wink:

I believe you guys want a “persistent multi-screen IDE layout”. A kind of: set the IDE layout as you want, and keep it that way unless you change it again, or the system detects a different screen real-estate available (a missing monitor for example, or rotation making it taller but narrowed, in such way some pallet/window gets unreachable, so it would have some way to recover the layout to the current available area). I also use 2 HD monitors and a Mac-Mini. Other IDEs can handle persistent and custom selectable layouts.

Under Windows, it is possible to set all open windows position and size (your app or not) with declares. It would be easy to come up with a small utility that keeps the palettes and the IDE in place.

It seems that is possible in AppleScript : http://ithug.com/2007/09/applescript-moving-and-resizing-windows/

I looked in SO and found this, which seems to more about utilities http://stackoverflow.com/questions/7076507/osx-tiling-window-managers/7249554#7249554

Once upon a time a Chinese traveler got into a restaurant in a village he was passing by and ordered a soup. He didn’t like it and called the cook. He told him it was missing salt and some spice. The cook agreed, and said all the customers always did the same complaint. So the customer said “Why you don’t just add some more salt and some more spices to the recipe?”. Then the cook said he had this old recipe written as it was, and just following it every day were simple, and he don’t intended to rewrite it; he said he was a cook and not a writer. Then he added “you can enhance the taste, it’s simple, I always say it to my customers: add more salt and pepper, I’ll get you some”. The traveler said that there’s no need, paid and left. Six month later, passing by that village again, the traveler couldn’t find that restaurant anymore.

Stop saying to your costumers to add salt and pepper to the soup when you know it’s missing ingredients from the beginning.

Have you filed a feature request for salt – sorry – saving and restore of IDE and palettes windows position ? Looks like a good idea, and something not terribly difficult to implement. If you think Xojo risks disappearing, it is kind of urgent…

It’s funny how I feel exactly the same about Windows. And how I predict you will too after time, but let’s not start a flame war, right?

The behavior you’re seeing is inherent in the Xojo IDE, not the Mac OS, and it didn’t used to be that way. There was a point when the IDE remembered the palette positions on alternate monitors, but that changed with some release. For me, I simply got used to it and now position the project on the main screen between the palettes, but then I have 27" to work with so the project window is quite large enough.

(Another annoying, but recent, development is that the palettes do not open when opening an existing project.)

(I’ll note that, through my years doing Mac consulting, I’ve observed that Windows users who switched to the Mac tended to expand every window to full screen while those who started on the Mac tend to use smaller windows. The latter allows easier access to background applications IMO, but it’s just a curiosity that’s neither here nor there in this discussion.)

There are two utilities that might help in your transition. The first is HyperDock which emulates Windows’ feature of showing a thumbnail of each open window when you hover over an app icon in the Dock.

The second is Keyboard Maestro, a very powerful macro app. You can use it to, among many, many other things, automatically move your pallets with a keystroke. Since this will require some AppleScript too (ordinarily enough with AppleScript-aware apps which, unfortunately, the IDE is not among), I’d be happy to lend a hand.

People had, if I do recall correctly. I am just talking about the need of people stop the let’s forget fixing and let’s invent workarounds and live with that. This cultural thing here should change.

I plead guilty. Fact is, I am no less demanding than the other guy, but a RAD is kind of double jeopardy for Xojo. If you look around, you got in fact two contradictory sets of demands : “please fix these old bugs right away”, and “please bring us iOS, 64 bits ASAP”. As developers, some of us are anxious to get their hands on the new (I am), while others pest that 2 years old bug reports (being kind) stay untouched.

I like progress over stability. To me, a totally stable, totally predictable Xojo (should I say RB ?) would be boring as hell. Actually, before iOS came, I was playing with Swift just because of a rather dull moment. Then I ferociously enjoyed the beta and the early release. Sure, there are a few oldies bu buggies I dislike very much. But overall, I rather have a racing car fun to drive than a punctual family wagon that rides at 90 Kilometers an hour (55 Mph). If that means living dangerously with workarounds, be it…

Besides, computing in itself would just be as boring as other industries if it was not, precisely, on the edge, constantly exploring new frontiers, working around obstacles. Blessed be iconoclasts like Steve Jobs. If we had to count on the IBM and HP of this world, they would probably still be talking about having PCs for the next decade. They are paragons of stability. But gosh, what a boring trip…

You probably are aware that this “probably simple IDE part” is managed by “other team” than the highly complex part related to new compilers and frameworks. They don’t compete, and both can advance together. So your first claim is invalid to THIS specific point.

I like both together. :wink:

[quote=187312:@Wayne Golding]So having just renewed my Xojo license I can now develop for the iOS platform. I’ve added a mac mini & two 24" screens to my desk. The screens are rotated 90 degrees which actually works well with the iOS screen configuration. My Xojo configuration is to have floating pallets for the inspector & library. Again this works well I’m able to get both pallets on the left of the main screen (inspector at the top), while the other (left) screen has the project.

But when I open a new project I need to move the window to the left screen & expand it’s size to fit and open the Inspector & Library pallets. Is this just what I need to get used to or is there a solution that works?
[/quote]
The default settings for where you placed “new project” should be saved but we did find a spot where that was not the case.
Kem and I tracked down an odd issue with such an arrangement so this bug probably isn’t addressed until a future release.

You have my sympathies :slight_smile: :stuck_out_tongue:
j/k I dont really care what you use

[quote=187312:@Wayne Golding]and quite frankly so far I can’t see why anyone would chose Mac.
[/quote]
One machine runs all the OS’s I care about (including Android, Solaris & a few others)
I’ve never owned a PC that I could do that with - even now.
My back & my desk appreciate that simplicity.
My current set up is OS X on 2 monitors & Windows 7 full screen on the third

Its what you get used to.
I actually started out on a PC way back when (1984 - 1990)
Worked for a big Mac shop & fell in love & never looked back
YMMV

Give him time, guys. Everyone needs 6-8 weeks to make the transition. I helped enough people to know it is not that easy, and the more familiar you are with Windows, the harder you’ll find it.

The hardest thing is to change your way of thinking and let go of the way Windows works.

After a while you’ll notice that the Mac way feels more natural and the Windows way more convoluted, and you start prefering Mac and dreading Windows … unless you are a hardcore gamer …

There are people who use Windows exclusively, and there are people who use Macs exclusively. The ones which can tell you more are the ones who use both - and the vast majority of those usually use PCs at work (aka no choice), and Macs at home (aka pay for it yourself).

So take it easy Wayne. You’ve got a lot more swearing to do before you “get” the Mac :wink:

It’s not unlike people coming to Xojo from some other dev language. There’s a time where you swear at Xojo because it won’t do something just like ‘x’ language. And then you start to get into the flow and realize that ‘x’ wasn’t what you really needed all along. It just takes time acclimate yourself to anything new.

Funny how perfectly rationale well educated people will dig their heels in harder when presented with evidence their beliefs are ill founded :stuck_out_tongue:
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/10/19/when-in-doubt-shout-why-shaking-someones-beliefs-turns-them-into-stronger-advocates/#.VVYtJ-tf0gg
https://www.dartmouth.edu/~nyhan/nyhan-reifler.pdf

Again just kidding wayne
I really dont give a hoot what you use
Use what works for you

So the general consensus is that the problem is with the Xojo IDE, not OSX and everyone is just living with the issues?

Don’t look at me, I’m still using REALstudio …!

My inclination is to believe there is a bug
Not sure if what Kem & I tracked down is it or not at this point

Well … an IDE bug and maybe that you’re expecting OS X to work like Windows
It doesn’t

Its not
Different bug
Case 24581