https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/27/tech/jony-ive-apple-leaving/index.html
now hopefully we get some reasonable design features … 
[quote=443226:@Dave S]https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/27/tech/jony-ive-apple-leaving/index.html
now hopefully we get some reasonable design features … :)[/quote]
You’re suggesting that Apple’s current problems are because of the a designer; not because of the constraints that he had to work too when designing products? I guess we’ll find out soon enough, if the ROI focused products continue…
No… I am suggesting that I (and I’m sure others) are not fans of his design philospy, both in how it affected the GUI/UX and how it influenced that hardware design (thinner is only a good thing to a point)
Hard to get thinner than a point! 
- karen
[quote=443230:@Karen Atkocius]Hard to get thinner than a point! 
- karen[/quote]
lol… true… but he kept trying
Making the product thinner can improve profit; uses less raw materials, remove ports & connectors on the logic board, remove screws and places for screws to go, use glue instead. This in turn makes it harder for the product to be repaired or upgraded, which means when the user needs needs more RAM or SSD, or has a broken spacebar. They’re pressured into buying a whole new product, which creates another sale.
Which is what makes me question, is it Jony’s decisions that have made the designs this way, or is it someone above Jony applying constraints on the design? We may never know for sure, but I time will give us an idea.
Skeuomorphic Design
My question has always been… did Apple as a company cave to Ive because he was “great”, or did they prove that a vast majority of their customers didn’t like it…
While I didn’t like “some” of it… I really don’t like “flat”,
For me Ive lost it when he took over interface design too and designed the sleek monochrome interface. It works for kitchens, but a user interface isnt a kitchen.
Then iTunes got progressively worse to the point where you got the feeling some second rate Windows programmers were put in charge. The iPhone no longer showed up in the sidebar which made dragging and dropping music difficult. My father couldnt use it at all anymore. User friendliness and usability in general had been abandoned. I found it interesting that Catalina seems to roll back some of the change (like a connected iPhone appears in the side bar again). Hopefully they went back to the original search behaviour too where the list gets smaller as you type.
Thats where I see the real reason for Ive leaving. His untouchable status - that depended on Jobs saying no at times - was no longer in tune with what users (or Apple) wanted - as demonstrated by the trash can Mac (Ives design) and now the redesigned Mac Pro (which seems engineering led).
The reality is that he’s been leaving for several years. With his new company, he’ll be able to continue to have some input into Apple’s products but he also gets to play in other markets, which seems to be his goal.
The way the macbooks have changed recently … I don’t want any of them.
I don’t want things any thinner, I do want USB2/3, I want a decent size hard drive not 128Gb, (or at least the option to update/replace it), and I do want a processor faster than 1.5Ghz
(Re-issue the 2015 versions or even a slight upgrade to them , and I’ll be at their door with cash.)
Assuming Ive was behind the iMac (a thing of beauty and a joy forever… or at least ‘in a cupboard because it is too lovely to throw away’) , and the iPhone, then he is a master at work.
But I do hope that this change leads to new thinking at Apple now.
I am not sure the recent MacBooks were so much Ive’s children.
Never forget Tim Cook used to be at procurement, and negotiated all the stuff with suppliers. Do you really think Ive would have permitted the more than ugly connector of the new Magic Mouse ? Are you convinced Ive had his say in the terrible pencil way of charging on the iPad Pro ?
To me, it looks much more like Ive was forced to witness the growing influence of marketing people, as he was powerless over what was actually sold without his say.
Exactly what Steve talked about in this video:
https://youtu.be/-AxZofbMGpM
https://daringfireball.net/2019/06/jony_ive_leaves_apple
I think this is a good post on the subject. I thought the Beatles analogy rang true.
I share @Michel Bujardet viewpoint. Time will tell, but I think he was Job’s guy and was inherited by Cook. I think the new stuff is not Ive’s, but is what he has been directed to put a lipstick to. Again time will tell.
Hope we finally will leave form-over-function behind us and get reasonable hardware again.
I love macOS but the $3500 (Swedish price) MBP 15" (mid-2018) is a piece of sh*t that I hate every second of working on without external monitors, keyboards and a proper mouse.
The new Mac Pro is a complete joke - please Apple, just give us an Apple motherboard with standard connectors and components. I don’t want to sell the farm to be able to buy a computer!
the MacPro isnt for that vast majority of people
“affordable” isnt a “pro” criteria
at least never was when I worked in those fields - the price tag was the LAST thing we ever looked at
Having watched apple since the 80s I cannot believe that Ives leaving will make things worse. They used to have a design philosophy, but I dont believe they do anymore. Usability is not what they are working towards. They have no overarching design philosophy for UI or anything that I can see. I would LOVE to know that this would help them return to a time when someone would get with the iTunes group and tell them O HELL NO! but I havent seen it. That doesnt mean that they arent still better than anyone else But the margin has decreased in the past few years by a lot.
Is undeniable that He has had merits in many things over the years, but if lost completely after the flat and annoying icons and operating system, gritty gradient colors on everything, not to mention the wired mouse underneath and the obsession for thin and tasteless products, I think it’s late already !
I for one am not looking forward to a return to wood-grain panelling backgrounds in the calendar app.
Nobody asks for that. But text that could or could not be a button? Monochrome Toolboxes not on a media consumption but media creation device? Bad design.
I saw how my father struggled with some updates and got increasingly frustrated because he couldnt do simple things like drag a song onto his iPad in iTunes. I had to google it: you need to drag and hold, then the iPad appears in the side bar, then you drag the song there, all the while holding, and hope that your arthritic fingers hold out that long. A gimmick that was implemented because somebody could, an essential function hidden and made more difficult. Bad design if ever I saw one.
On his iPad music suddenly played in random order. He couldnt figure out how to turn it off. I myself couldnt figure it out and had to google for the solution. Thats simply bad interface design.
Macs used to be easy. Intuitive. Not so much anymore.
Ive at his best is genius, no doubt. But to get the best consistently required Jobs, who said (Im paraphrasing) it is more important to say no and not do everything we could, to focus on what is important and make that simple but powerful
Jobs brought an attention to detail and appreciation for elegance that most people lack.
Beside of arthritic fingers, if your finger does ausrutsch (slip) from the mouse button, the holded object is also lost (or being moved elsewhere as well).