I recently discovered that Pariahware has decided to become a pariah in the Xojo Community and that Christian cut off support for his ElasticWindow classes. I had purchased them several years ago as part of one of the OmegaBundles and find the classes to be useful in certain instances but they need some continued work.
I’ve tried contacting Christian a couple times to see if I could purchase his source code (he offered the unencrypted classes to me once but I never took him up on it). I have not heard back from him. Looks like he’s deciding to divorce himself from all things Xojo.
So does anyone have his source code? Or does anyone have a valid replacement?
There should be a rule among developers that if a developer decides to no longer support a product he was selling, he should open source it. I have an ethical qualm about developers that sell something, users become dependent upon it and then when the developer decides they are done supporting it, they leave all their customers in the lurch. I get why people want to make money on software (heck it’s what I’m trying to do!). But if you aren’t going to support a product, don’t screw your customers. Just publish your source code…
Or at least be courteous enough to answer a customer when the send you an e-mail via your website…
I think he doesn’t use Xojo anymore, and moved on. Last I heard he was trying to find an interested party to purchase the Elastic Windows Classes from him, so that development would continue. Not sure if anyone has contacted him though.
I’m in your boat, Jon. Bought the software about 2 years ago and used it in a rather major desktop app I developed for my largest customer. So far (keeping my fingers crossed and my hands clasped in hopeful prayer) I haven’t had it “break” with any Xojo or Windows update, but it is truly a tenuous position to be in. If by any chance you happen to hear more about availability of the source code, I’d sure be interested to know what you find out.
I was also in the same boat as you all. But fortunately one of my friend purchased the unencrypted source from him and shared(after paying) with me. Now my friend and the developer are no more using xojo. Is it ethical now to share the source code with the community or not. I dont know about the legality in it. Please share your thought. After that i may publish as the developer is not supporting.
Unless the creator of the classes explicitly releases his intellectual property to the public, then I would certainly advise against sharing it openly.
OK … now, we’re narrowing it down … is there an I.P. (Intellectual Property) lawyer in the Xojo house? Next best thing would be asking Kem Tekinay … he knows that RegEx stuff backwards and forwards and that’s about as close to the gobbledy gook of I.P. legalese as I’ve ever seen! ^^
I did not want to talk about it too early, but it seems the field of conscience has once again conjured an interesting coincidence. Here is a demo of RubberViews, a class I had created for myself a while ago, until James Redway persuaded me to make it available to the public.
I had never looked at Elastic Windows before, so I was amazed to see it was similar when I looked in the WayBack machine. However, RubberViews manages the content up to image sizes, including window backdrop, works within a Container control, and has an option to keep the aspect ratio of a control or a series of controls, for instance ovals that remain circles when resized. Plus, the content of HTMLViewer is resized as well to keep constant with the window size.
Consider it a beta release. All comments and suggestion appreciated. I am planning to make it available very soon.
Supports all versions of Xojo from 2013R1 up to 2015R2 currently in beta. Tested under Mac OS X up to 10.10.2 and Windows up to Windows 10 Tech Preview.
[quote=179589:@Jon Ogden]I’ve tried contacting Christian a couple times to see if I could purchase his source code (he offered the unencrypted classes to me once but I never took him up on it). I have not heard back from him. Looks like he’s deciding to divorce himself from all things Xojo.
…
Or at least be courteous enough to answer a customer when the send you an e-mail via your website…[/quote]
Hi Jon, sorry I didn’t reply to your email from last week. Everybody (else) who has contacted me privately I have given them the demo classes from the web site and told them they could still purchase an Elastic Window license from me. None have taken me up on the offer.
If you want to upgrade to the source version, I’m happy to take your money.
Ethically, while I have been approached a couple of times with people interested in buying the rights from me, no money has been discussed. As far as releasing it for free to the community, it’s kind of the same boat. People still expect one to maintain it even though they have the ability to fix the problem themselves.
Nice stuff, Michel! Just downloaded and tried the demo app. I’m going to play around with it some more this weekend, but from what little I’ve already seen with the demo, please consider me an “interested party” in any future plans you have for RubberViews.
That sounds a lot like milking a dead cow. I think most will rather wait for AutoLayout than invest in a dead product.
It’s not.
I don’t want to tell you how to run your business, but speaking of “ethics” two possible solutions come to mind:
(1) Rather than leaving your customers out in the cold and potentially stuck send them the source code so they might be able to deal with any trouble arising in the future.
(2) Open-source it.
The way you are dealing with it makes me VERY hesitant to ever buy anything from your company again. I know it isn’t very likely anyway, but my point is that you are not doing your reputation any favours, and that might come round to bite you in the long run. It takes years to build a good reputation, but just moments to ruin it.
Ah, but you are. I haven’t been around here for awhile but I know you like to rock the boat Markus.
I sold the product for years. In encrypted & unencrypted versions.
Customers were notified that the unencrypted version was going away and provided an upgrade path (for at least a year).
When I announced I was no longer going to sell Elastic Window, nobody made an offer to buy the rights, but everybody wants it for free.
Glad you are interested. I will appreciate your comments.
[quote=179630:@Dave S]Seems in todays technolgies (and Xojo has indicated this may be coming… iOS already has it)…
AutoLayout…
a royal PITA (my opinion), but the way of the future it seems
What someone needs to do is come up with a Autolayout class that works today, and can be superceded easily with XOJO release a formal version[/quote]
Auto Layout is coming for Desktop in a very indeterminate future. And we all know what it means. AFAIK it is not even slated, so not even “ready when it is ready”. Now, for having worked with the iOS version quite a bit, I still hold to RubberViews, because they are not quite the same thing.
Auto Layout requires setting for each control the relationship it will have with the window (or view in iOS) as well as other controls in regards to placement and size. Since there are many options, it is very powerful, but also very complex. Just imagine if you have 200 controls on a window… And some have even more.
Another important limit of Xojo iOS Auto Layout is that it does not manage content. You can set a control to grow when the device is rotated (could be a window you enlarge), but the font size won’t change. Same thing for tables. Same thing for pictures.
RubberViews or Elastic Window are more limited in matters of choice for each control. For instance, RubberViews allows deciding that certain controls will not be managed, or that they will keep their aspect ratio (circles, squares). But on the whole, it is a turnkey solution : place it onto the window, call init in open and sizAll in Resized, and that’s all you got to worry about. All controls are managed at all sizes and resolutions without any special setting.
The RubberViews engine started back in 2013 for my own use, when I switched from RS to Xojo, so at the time I had no idea about such thing as Auto Layout. Today I would say that it can be considered like if Auto Layout was used with all controls constraints as for instance :
Left = Parent.Right*5%
Right = Parent.Right*20%
Top = Parent.Bottom*10%
Bottom = Parent.Bottom*20%
With the rather unpleasant editing system in the Inspector for these constraints, in spite of a good training, I spent a quarter hour entering this in Xojo. Then you have to do that for all controls.
With RubberViews, it is instant for all the controls on a window or on a container control at the same time.
I do not believe it is impossible to come up with Auto Layout for Desktop and for Web. But I do believe it would be a royal PITA for users, for very little gain in that matter.
Auto Layout was mainly implemented to make decide rotation easier. And it does.
Desktop is another challenge. From Windows tablets at 1012x768 up to 4K screens at 2550x1600 and probably more soon, it becomes near impossible to manage all these sizes manually. Without a proper management of font and picture sizes, a window designed at 1200x800 maximized on a 2550x1600 screen will show fonts made for ants.
Same punishment for Canvas. Say you have a canvas that looks nice on a small window. Unless you specifically conceive your paint code to adjust with control size, it will quickly become inadequate. RubberCanvas let you draw in Paint at the design size, and it will take care of all the resizing transparently.
As I go along and design apps for myself, I intend to add features that are relevant to desktop. When and if Auto Layout comes to Xojo Desktop, and unless it messes up our current left, top, width and height, I am convinced it will not deprecate a tool that manages a whole window at once.
