An error, an omission

General
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Hi,

I let you find the error here in TextEdit.Italic, and I will talk about the omission.

In OS X, you cannot ask for a style anymore (Bold, Italic, Underline, etc.) if you do not have the corresponding Font. This does not appears in the TextArea description, not only for Italic, but also for Bold and Underline (as these are defined Properties of the TextArea (not only, but also).

AS noted, this does not impact (IMHO) Linux and Windows applications.

Nota: it is a bit strange to not get the style you choose while Bold and Underline works fine. So I read the specific entry in the docs and… recall the “new” OS X behavior (I think this comes in Lion, not sure).

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[quote=118853:@Emile Schwarz]Hi,

I let you find the error here in TextEdit.Italic, and I will talk about the omission.

In OS X, you cannot ask for a style anymore (Bold, Italic, Underline, etc.) if you do not have the corresponding Font. This does not appears in the TextArea description, not only for Italic, but also for Bold and Underline (as these are defined Properties of the TextArea (not only, but also).

AS noted, this does not impact (IMHO) Linux and Windows applications.

Nota: it is a bit strange to not get the style you choose while Bold and Underline works fine. So I read the specific entry in the docs and… recall the “new” OS X behavior (I think this comes in Lion, not sure).[/quote]

Cocoa is conformant to the OpenType specifications. Indeed if the correct font for the style does not exist, the system does not “fake” it did in the past with an oblique version of the normal font.

Typographically, Italics are not simply a slanted version of the normal font.

Here is what Carbon does when the italic font is not here : it fakes it by slanting the normal font

Here is the true italic :

IMHO, Cocoa is doing the right thing.

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Isn’t it what I wrote ?

Of course, your answer is far better than my quoted text !

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[quote=118866:@Emile Schwarz]Isn’t it what I wrote ?

Of course, your answer is far better than my quoted text ![/quote]

I never said you were wrong. I just wanted to show why Cocoa no longer faked italics, and what is the difference.

5

OK.

The purpose of this conversation was to note that this information is missing from the docs (OS X).

Did you find the error (here )?

Hint: the error does not appears in the Bold property (of course) nor in the underline property.

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[quote=118877:@Emile Schwarz]OK.

The purpose of this conversation was to note that this information is missing from the docs (OS X).

Did you find the error (here )?

Hint: the error does not appears in the Bold property (of course) nor in the underline property.[/quote]

You mean “If True, applies the bold style to the control’s caption and/or its text content if any.” ? Where it should read “italic” ?

When I find errors in the LR, I usually file a bug report about that with a precise description and the page link, and it usually is corrected right away by Xojo’s industrious staff (Thanks). Why not do the same ?

Underline is not a style, it is an attribute. So it is not tied to any particular font file. In terms of usage, it does not change a lot, but that means you do not have to fear it will not be applied, like that would happen with bold, italic or bold italic.

You may note that some fonts have styles beyond the usual bold, italic or bold italic available through the IDE. This is the case for instance for Avenir, which has “Light Oblique”. This particular style does not appear in the IDE, but will display fine if you set the font manually (or by code) to “Avenir Light Oblique”.

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Michel,

usually, you defend Windows. In this case, we have a different behavior (Windows vs OS X).

What I was trying to say at first is that in the current Xojo (since 2013r1) docs is lacking a piece of description.

Now, if I cannot advertise the whole forum with these kind of misses (you forgot the error, did you find it ?), I will stop sharing them.

Remember: the current Xojo allows you to set Bold, Italic and Underscore. That may be good (for Windows users). But the OS X users have to know that this is not the way to do that.

As an example, a friend of mine cannot print a XPress document (years) ago because he set the Bold emphasis on a Bold font. It tooks time to find it.

So, warning our developer friends is IMHO a good idea.

I am not in the Fonts business, but I work on the Computer business since… 1980 ? I can have an experience on some parts of this business ;-:slight_smile:

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[quote=119086:@Emile Schwarz]Michel,

usually, you defend Windows. In this case, we have a different behavior (Windows vs OS X).

What I was trying to say at first is that in the current Xojo (since 2013r1) docs is lacking a piece of description.

Now, if I cannot advertise the whole forum with these kind of misses (you forgot the error, did you find it ?), I will stop sharing them.

Remember: the current Xojo allows you to set Bold, Italic and Underscore. That may be good (for Windows users). But the OS X users have to know that this is not the way to do that.

As an example, a friend of mine cannot print a XPress document (years) ago because he set the Bold emphasis on a Bold font. It tooks time to find it.

So, warning our developer friends is IMHO a good idea.

I am not in the Fonts business, but I work on the Computer business since… 1980 ? I can have an experience on some parts of this business ;-:)[/quote]

I do not defend Windows more than Mac, and have had both on my desk since 1982. I was a computer journalist for l’Ordinateur Individuel then Temps Micro, then Soft & Micro and a friend of Jean-Louis Gassée back in France while you were at Apple France, so we may have about the same amount of historical experience.

My point is that when something is missing in the documentation, instead of making it a treasure hunt game, I think you best help your fellow developers by reporting the bug through Feedback. to give a chance to Xojo to repair the error. Stop sharing your quizzes if you want, this is not a TV show.

It appears your message was for Cocoa users, then why did you post it in General instead of OS X ? And in what could you think I do not agree it is a good idea to warn users about the fact that when a font is not present the corresponding style is not faked ? All I did was to illustrate graphically the difference between Carbon and Cocoa.

Sorry for having tried to complete the information you posted, if that offended you. Next time I will start my own thread to respect you little game.

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34812 - Italic Property error in description

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