Upgrade Price (Desktop to Pro) ?

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  2. last week

    Üllar K

    Sep 15 Estonia

    @Paul Sondervan As mentioned a couple of times before, send an email to hello@xojo.com and they will help you with the correct price for the upgrade.

    At first I apologize, as my native language is not English, so my thoughts may be not clearly understandable as I don’t understand that behavior suggested by Paul Sondervan and I never will. Why I must connect with somebody to get correct upgrade/update price? Why there are not clearly displayed upgrade prices? For me – yes, I’m stupid – it tells that Xojo fellows don’t care about their valued customers. So easy it is. Yes – maybe I’m child who tells truth that king is naked, but somebody mast tell about things as they are.

    Xojo – you have almost very good selling and promoting strategy, but this strategy does not value old loyal customers. Yes – first buy price is reasonable, but sell for returning customers with same price again and again – it is – I have no such bad words, you know. Instead making conferences which is like party in plague time and intend again only for getting more money from old good customers, please make from Xojo at least good multiplatform successor for Access. Now in Xojo there are dataobjects and reports, but they are joke and you know it yourself. If be honest, then Xojo now is pretty toy. Overpriced toy. At least nail about every 5 years one version of Xojo to wall and rename it for example “Long time developer version XXXX.RR”. And then you can make new versions, but also please repair bugs from that “Long time version”. Unfortunately if you make always new versions, then something can be broke and did not work as intended, as happened to me. I want to use newest version, because textarea in Xojo 2014r3.2 is buggy, but I can’t, as 2018r2 MySQL plugin gives me unknown SSL error when I connect to MariaDB irrespective of circumstance that I don’t use and don’t need SSL. I read about that error from forum and replaced that MySQL plugin to plugin from Xojo version 2015r1. Yes – it helped for that project, but another project with works in two places and connects to same database server, but different databases with same structure, one behaves so strangely with 2015r1 plugin, so is not usable. So beware about using 2015r1 MySQL plugin in newer Xojos. I have wrote same programs with Xojo and one made with Xojo 2014r3.2 is responsible for collecting data and making invoices based to that data approximately to 5 thousand families every month. So you can imagine what I must think and feel when I run across those bad circumstances.

    Please make Xojo serious tool, as you have been planned at beginning. No need to run fancy ipad amok before all other thing works as intended. And by pricing, why not take for update ¼ from full price by elapse first year. If there elapses two years without updating, then half price, if elapses three years, then ¾ from full prices and if you haven’t updated within four years, then you must pay full price again. It would be more user and customer friendly instead of paying full price every year for buggy and full of surprises versions.

    Best advertise is yours customer’s good words about Xojo. Not for you, but for other people. Mouth to mouth advertising is best magnet for new customers. No one conference can’t do that. And if you make from Xojo solid working tool for using databases and collecting, processing and displaying data they consist, you will be swim in money soon…

  3. Dana B

    Sep 15 Xojo Inc Austin, Texas

    @ÜllarKruustik At first I apologize, as my native language is not English, so my thoughts may be not clearly understandable as I don’t understand that behavior suggested by Paul Sondervan and I never will. Why I must connect with somebody to get correct upgrade/update price? Why there are not clearly displayed upgrade prices? For me – yes, I’m stupid – it tells that Xojo fellows don’t care about their valued customers. So easy it is. Yes – maybe I’m child who tells truth that king is naked, but somebody mast tell about things as they are.

    Thanks for your feedback. We absolutely care about our customers, we all come to work every day to make a better product for you. Xojo is not like other companies, we are here in the forum listening, answering questions - we are always accessible on email or forum private message. It's 6AM here on a Saturday and I really wanted to answer your post. :)

    Having said that, this thread is about upgrade pricing, not "update" or renewal pricing - that is clearly posted in our store. The original question was about upgrading from Desktop to Pro. To upgrade (or change versions) we have to calculate special pricing, because we do want our users to have a discount. Just paying the cost difference between the two versions is not fair to some people who might want to apply more than one key to the upgrade.

    Xojo – you have almost very good selling and promoting strategy, but this strategy does not value old loyal customers. Yes – first buy price is reasonable, but sell for returning customers with same price again and again

    Licenses that are set to auto renew receive a 10% discount.

    Mouth to mouth advertising is best magnet for new customers.

    I couldn't agree more. This is definitely the strongest form of marketing for us, and for a lot of our users too, in fact.

  4. Markus W

    Sep 15 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro #JeSuisHuman Germany, Heidelb...

    @ÜllarKruustik I have no such bad words

    I could send you some if you want … ;)

    At least nail about every 5 years one version of Xojo to wall and rename it for example “Long time developer version XXXX.RR”. And then you can make new versions, but also please repair bugs from that “Long time version”.

    I’m with you on that one, but not gonna happen …

    Unfortunately if you make always new versions, then something can be broke and did not work as intended, as happened to me.

    I predicted that when they introduced the Rapid Release Model. Wasn’t a difficult prediction to make …

    I want to use newest version, because textarea in Xojo 2014r3.2 is buggy, but I can’t, as 2018r2 MySQL plugin gives me unknown SSL error when I connect to MariaDB irrespective of circumstance that I don’t use and don’t need SSL. I read about that error from forum and replaced that MySQL plugin to plugin from Xojo version 2015r1. Yes – it helped for that project, but another project with works in two places and connects to same database server, but different databases with same structure, one behaves so strangely with 2015r1 plugin, so is not usable. So beware about using 2015r1 MySQL plugin in newer Xojos.

    The plugin structure changed at some point, so using the old plugin might be a really bad idea …

    And by pricing, why not take for update ¼ from full price by elapse first year. If there elapses two years without updating, then half price, if elapses three years, then ¾ from full prices and if you haven’t updated within four years, then you must pay full price again. It would be more user and customer friendly instead of paying full price every year for buggy and full of surprises versions.

    Interesting approach. If you are going to upgrade within the next four years then you might just as well keep your license up-to-date … though it does allow you when money is tight to opt out and get back in without a financial penalty to Xojo (as if you stop for a year it is now a half-price upgrade vs two quarter-price upgrades if you keep your license going).

    I like it.

  5. Emile S

    Sep 15 Europe (France, Strasbourg)

    @Dana B Emile, according to our records we have two paid orders from you - one for your $99 license in 1998 and 1 for a renewal of that license in 2013.

    No, your records are wrong, but this is not important (for me).
    I have one upgrade from your (long time) French distributor, but not only.
    I do not set records of that, but I think I have upgraded version 1 to 2, 3, 4, 5, 2005, another for Carbon (but the Carbon release comes once that license expired *), then probably the current one, from 2013). Not 100% sure. In the list, I had a Pro license (somewhere).

    * I think it was from there that I started to skip some releases.

    Also, this was a simple question, I do not know if / when I will renew. So, I will wait until then.

    Thank you.

  6. Üllar K

    Sep 15 Estonia

    @Markus W I could send you some if you want … ;)

    Thanks, Markus! Never too late to learn... :P

  7. Markus W

    Sep 15 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro #JeSuisHuman Germany, Heidelb...

    @ÜllarKruustik Thanks, Markus! Never too late to learn... :P

    When I was at school we had an italien “exchange student” as our guest for a few weeks. She taught my little brother some Italian. Turned out later when we visited Italy that they were really really bad swear words which would make a mafioso blush …

  8. Üllar K

    Sep 15 Estonia

    @Dana B Having said that, this thread is about upgrade pricing, not "update" or renewal pricing - that is clearly posted in our store.

    Yes, Dana, I understand, but I think there is no need to make new topic, as upgrade and update are not so far things from each other. And if be honest, I have no idea how yours upgrade plane works. If for example I want after 10 month upgrade from Desktop to Pro, how long my Pro license will extend and how much it cost? Two months by upgrade price (2 months Pro price minus 2 months desktop price) or 12 months (12 months Pro price minus 2 months desktop price)? Or are there other schemas?

    But it’s a just a math and I have seen lots of systems, that show one price but after identifying yourself you see prices exactly for you accordingly your licenses and buying history. I don’t need shiver hand nor beg somebody for long time loyal customer prices. That was reason, I wrote my comment. Sorry.

  9. Üllar K

    Sep 15 Estonia

    @Markus W Turned out later when we visited Italy that they were really really bad swear words which would make a mafioso blush …

    Nice to hear that you and your family were safe in Italy as even mafioso guys afraid or/and shamed your company just for fresh Italian vocabulary your little brother obtained from kind Italian girl. :D

  10. Emile S

    Sep 15 Europe (France, Strasbourg)

    Dana,

    a simple search on one of my external hard disk, I found license numbers and dates of RALbasic and Real Studio (*) for both Mac OS and Windows platforms (there was a time the license numbers were different, by platform).

    I can send you (at your eMail address) these html files (auto generated by Real Software web servers). I do not saw entries for versions 2, 3, 4, but some entries with license numbers and NA.

    (*) I never download the (Expired on 2010-02-23) REAL Server unlimited software (no use, but part of the Pro license at a time), is it still supported ?
    (Just curious. And no, I still do not have a use for that.)

  11. Dana B

    Sep 15 Xojo Inc Austin, Texas

    @Emile S I can send you (at your eMail address

    Yes, if you would like to look more at the pricing for upgrading from Desktop to Pro, please contact Customer Service at hello@xojo.com.

  12. Markus W

    Sep 15 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro #JeSuisHuman Germany, Heidelb...

    @Emile S: i think that part of the problem is that Xojo folds your old licenses into the new one. I remember when I upgraded to REAL.studio 2011 all my older licenses disappeared from my account … I was not happy as I had intended to pass them on …

  13. Dana B

    Sep 15 Xojo Inc Austin, Texas
    Edited last week

    @ÜllarKruustik If for example I want after 10 month upgrade from Desktop to Pro, how long my Pro license will extend and how much it cost?

    If you upgrade you would get a NEW Pro license (all new licenses come with 1 year of updates). That new license would be discounted by the pro-rated value remaining in the upgraded license(s), which would be cancelled. That day, the new license would become active and expire in 12 months.

  14. Tim S

    Sep 15 Canterbury, UK
    Edited last week

    @ÜllarKruustik If for example I want after 10 month upgrade from Desktop to Pro, how long my Pro license will extend and how much it cost?

    Today I did an upgrade (NOT renewal) of my Lite licence to a Desktop licence. In effect, I traded it in, like when you exchange your old car for a new one at the dealer and get some money for the old car. Except it's a bit better with a Xojo licence as you can calculate the trade-in value yourself - it seems to be pro-rated on the remaining time left on your old licence.

    I'm happy about that but only wish I had done it sooner, perhaps six months ago. The reason I didn't was because until this thread it was unclear to me that the trade-in existed in this way, so I thought that if I upgraded then I lost the value of the existing licence. The new licence is for 12 months so it expires in a year's time.

    @Dana B Perhaps that option needs to be clarified a little on the website.

  15. Anthony M

    Sep 15 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro

    @Markus W

    >> At least nail about every 5 years one version of Xojo to wall and rename it for example “Long time developer version XXXX.RR”. And then you can make new versions, but also please repair bugs from that “Long time version.

    I’m with you on that one, but not gonna happen …

    Why not? Whether or not one agrees wth everything Ullar said this is one of the most sensible and reasonable expectations from any product. You should never have to pay for bug fixes. Features, yes. Enhancements, sure. Bug fixes, never! Any serious product should have an actively maintained LT release cycle that spans at minimum three years. Having to buy an upgrade to a product to fix a debilitating or crippling bug just because your version’s maintence has ended is unreasonable.

    I don’t expect anything to be given for free and paying to play is the name of the game but if you can’t play with what you’ve already paid for because of a bug then there is a problem.

    Xojo, please listen to this! A long-term release running parallel to a feature release would be a boost for your customers. Fixing bugs only in new releases makes no sense. Having to upgrade from one major release to another to fix a bug while breaking 3 other things is counter-productive.

  16. Markus W

    Sep 15 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro #JeSuisHuman Germany, Heidelb...

    @Anthony M Why not? Whether or not one agrees wth everything Ullar said

    I didn‘t say I‘m against it, on the contrary, I said it isn‘t going to happen. And you can quite easily figure out why yourself …

  17. Tim P

    Sep 15 Pre-Release Testers feedback://46303

    I like the "trade in" explanation. That really clarifies what's going on for those who don't quite understand the upgrade idea :)

  18. Üllar K

    Sep 15 Estonia

    @Dana Brown If you upgrade you would get a NEW Pro license (all new licenses come with 1 year of updates).

    Yes, indeed, thanks Dana. It’s logical and pragmatic, but I was more interested about upgrade price logic and still am. How complicated it can be, as even computer can’t calculate it and there is need for personal touch, wasting yours customers and team time?

  19. Alberto D

    Sep 15 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro

    @ÜllarKruustik Yes, indeed, thanks Dana. It’s logical and pragmatic, but I was more interested about upgrade price logic and still am. How complicated it can be, as even computer can’t calculate it and there is need for personal touch, wasting yours customers and team time?

    Üllar, I think the webpage usually calculate that correctly if it has your information and you select your license. At least it happened correctly with my upgrade from Lite to PRO last year.

    Maybe, in this case, because the license was expired or changed from old version.

    I think is great that we can contact them by email, if needed. Most of the time is not.

  20. Dana B

    Sep 15 Xojo Inc Austin, Texas
    Edited last week

    People do not need to contact us to calculate their upgrade pricing. It can be calculated from the Licenses page in your account.

    Rather than trying to help people with specific Customer Service issues on the forum, we request to be contacted at Customer Service. It's easier to help there because people can sometimes be confused by another persons specific situation if it is different from theirs. We are always available by email at hello@xojo.com or the forum, of course. And now during our business hours, we have live chat that we are trying out! So we are here!

  21. Dana B

    Sep 15 Xojo Inc Austin, Texas

    @Tim P I like the "trade in" explanation. That really clarifies what's going on for those who don't quite understand the upgrade idea :)

    I agree - a great explanation that most people can understand! Thanks @Tim S & we are glad you are happy with your shiny new Desktop license :)

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