Why Xojo Inc. acts like this?

  1. 3 years ago

    At November 2015 I sent e-mail to Xojo support:

    What the hell will go on? Why you are doing this? :(

    Every time, I go to your forum, at beginning is all right. After three minute or so, your server refuses to serve until 10-15 minutes passes and then all will be ok again till I close browser. Then the same happens! And yes – you are blocking me, because if I connect from different IP (from mobile network) all works again at beginning but from earlier opened computer browser still refuses to connect? What is purpose of that behavior? Are you overworked or what? Can you tell me, why I must want to collaborate with you and give you some of my money? You can think that you are some kind of clever, but I don’t think so. Please explain me, why you forum acts like that, what is the purpose of that?

    Not so happy,
    Üllar

    They answered, but those were so stupid answers a’la how many browsers you open and how many tabs in browser you use! Yes, we fight with scammers.

    Come on! I use everything as usual with one opened browser and few tabs, but with other sites – and I surf a lot – there are no such problems. Can anybody explain me what is purpose of that? Why Xojo does this?

    And it is not only forum that not communicates – whole Xojo site will be down for approximately 10 minutes. Please! Again – I’m stupid – tell me why that behavior is good?

  2. Jeff T

    19 Dec 2016 Pre-Release Testers Midlands of England, Europe

    Hi Üllar.

    This wont help your situation, but that never happens to me, or the majority of people on the Forum.
    With respect, an angry email like that does not encourage people to want to help.

    If you open too many tabs at the same time from the same IP address, the forum eventually treats your IP address as the source of a denial of service attack.
    'After 3 minutes' sounds very quick to run into that.
    So, calmly.. how many tabs DO you open at once?

  3. For example today morning (and every time I visit Xojo forum) only two – one Xojo main page from where I clicked to Forum link. That’s all I usually do. Is that tooooo much? And in that tab where is Xojo main page I browse my others everyday pages. So – at beginning two, but after only one. And yes, if I found something interesting in forum, I open it in new tab or in new browser, but I think it is logical and allowed? And not more than 4 to 6. But after the block is gone, I can open tens of tabs or browsers and all works fine, until I close last browser with Xojo site. Then, after going to Xojo site, after few minutes ban occurs again about 10 minutes, and then all will good again. But that is frustrating, because if I want some answers from forum, I want it now, I don’t want wait 10 minutes. Only solution is that I must be keep one browser with Xojo site open, but come on – this is not polite solution.

  4. Markus W

    19 Dec 2016 #JeSuisHuman New Zealand, Auc...

    Jeff, on the contrary, that happened to quite a few peole, including me.

    For us it is normal browsing behaviour to open a list of links, and then open interesting topics in new tabs to read. Some tabs remain open as they contain interesting stuff (code examples, interesting suggestions) that requires further processing.

    The forum software does not always deal with this gracefully, especially when you also constantly switch between computer and iPad, and don't get me started on restarting the browser when dozens or hundreds of tabs need to be reopened.

    I too have been told it is to fight spammers, but I suspect it is more an inconvenience to users than actually helping.

    Ullar: your manners and tone leave a LOT to be desired. If you continue then you will quickly find that forum members become less interested in helping you. They might even block you and will then never see anything you wrote. That's one reason why this forum is a more civilised one: there seem to be mainly experienced older programmers around, and they value manners and simply don't tolerate behaviour such as yours.

  5. Jeff T

    19 Dec 2016 Pre-Release Testers Midlands of England, Europe

    In order to speed up your browsing, some software 'reads ahead'
    While you have one screen open, its pulling data from screens linked to /available from the one you can see.
    So there could be many connections going on you know nothing about.

    What browser are you using, and do you have any optimising software of that kind in use?

  6. No – I hate those “optimizing softwares”. :D And I don’t need them with my 50M internet connection.

    I’m the last big whale and use IE11, as it works fine for me. But I have tried Firefox, Chrome and even Safari. Results are same.

  7. Hi,

    I always open as many tabs as I need to check the threads that interest me (it can easily go over 10 tabs with different conversations of this forum open simultaneously) and I never saw this behavior.

    Instead of ONLY blaming the forum configuration, I would ALSO look into other possibilities (at your end).

    The "software optimization" here is not protecting you, but the forum.

    Julen

  8. Markus – I usually don’t ask help and I’m very patient. Maybe you don’t know what happens, when all frustration accumulates, but if "highborn" fellows instead of helping begin ask childish questions, then I can’t be calm. If somebody insults me, why I can’t insult back? I’m not a Christian and don’t turn my other cheek for slapping. Sorry.

    And by the way can you please tell me which words of mine abused you? Thanks.

  9. Emile S

    19 Dec 2016 Europe (France, Strasbourg)

    Üllar,

    When you open a window (or a Tab) in your browser, you open an active connection with the server.

    This is why people ask you how many open tabs you have.

    The page checks the server in a regular basis for update(s). If you close the internet connection, you will rapidly see a message like "Unable to connect to the server” (something like that).

    HTH.

  10. Emile? And point of your comment is...? I don't allowed more than one active connection with Xojo server? Are you serious?

  11. Michel B

    19 Dec 2016 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro

    I think I will ignore this thread. Nothing good can come out of it.

  12. @Michel: Sorry to hear that. What happened with natural born discussion via little disagreement?
    @Markus: What I must to tell to men who seriously insist to use by blind believe native features, even if they are compromised? Only “shame on you”. If you can't live with it, you just tolerate stupidity and blind believe. Blind believe (even blind believe to superior of native controls) is most dangerous thing in the world. It is primary source of wars. If you have doubts, you can learn. If you have only believes, you learn nothing.
    @Jeff: I must it say that by “highborn fellows” I don’t mean you. I’m appreciated about you will to help. Thanks.

  13. Tomas J

    19 Dec 2016 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro Europe (Germany)

    Ja I agree with Michel cause the sub-tone is kind of offensive. But I would like to add this one: If you really need so much connections then I strongly suggest to use a proxy server (squid/squidguard).

  14. Will S

    19 Dec 2016 Santa Cruz 

    don't feed what's under the bridge :P

  15. don't think is wrong.. a few month ago there is so many spamer..

  16. Greg O

    19 Dec 2016 Xojo Inc scout.galaxy.barn

    @ÜllarKruustik At November 2015 I sent e-mail to Xojo support:

    What the hell will go on? Why you are doing this? :(

    Every time, I go to your forum, at beginning is all right. After three minute or so, your server refuses to serve until 10-15 minutes passes and then all will be ok again till I close browser. Then the same happens! And yes – you are blocking me, because if I connect from different IP (from mobile network) all works again at beginning but from earlier opened computer browser still refuses to connect? What is purpose of that behavior? Are you overworked or what? Can you tell me, why I must want to collaborate with you and give you some of my money? You can think that you are some kind of clever, but I don’t think so. Please explain me, why you forum acts like that, what is the purpose of that?

    Not so happy,
    Üllar

    They answered, but those were so stupid answers a’la how many browsers you open and how many tabs in browser you use! Yes, we fight with scammers.

    Come on! I use everything as usual with one opened browser and few tabs, but with other sites – and I surf a lot – there are no such problems. Can anybody explain me what is purpose of that? Why Xojo does this?

    And it is not only forum that not communicates – whole Xojo site will be down for approximately 10 minutes. Please! Again – I’m stupid – tell me why that behavior is good?

    Since we're just starting to wake up in the U.S...

    I'm sorry you are frustrated with this experience.

    To answer your question, Yes, we do have very aggressive security on our servers. It's not just the forum that is protected like this, but all of our web services.

    The causes of being temporarily locked out are not just how many connections you have, but how quickly you create them. So if you go to the main page of the forum and quickly ctrl-click five or six topics, I can see that causing a problem. Remember, each new tab opened means three or four new connections to the server to quickly send you the initial page, after which most browsers will only keep one or two open.

    I know that this is nearly the same answer that you got from tech support, but I wanted to clarify (as one of the guys that deals with this stuff) that we are not singling you out, but we are also not tuning back our security for this. Having run a web hosting company myself for several years, I take the security of our servers very seriously at Xojo, and since not having enough also means that we can't be focusing on improving our product for you, we tend to err on the side of caution.

  17. Eli O

    is not verified 19 Dec 2016 Europe (Berlin, Germany)
    Edited 3 years ago

    @Greg OLone The causes of being temporarily locked out are not just how many connections you have, but how quickly you create them. So if you go to the main page of the forum and quickly ctrl-click five or six topics,

    As a small test I just opened the top 20 threads of this forum each into its own tab as fast as possible. And then I went to each tab and reloaded the page. No problem, it all works, no lock-out.

  18. Phillip Z

    19 Dec 2016 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro Florence, SC

    @Eli O As a small test I just opened the top 20 threads of this forum each into its own tab as fast as possible. And then I went to each tab and reloaded the page. No problem, it all works, no lock-out.

    What browser? Some browsers now have a look ahead feature (Microsoft Edge) that will start downloading all the links on a page to make page browsing seem faster.

  19. Phillip Z

    19 Dec 2016 Pre-Release Testers, Xojo Pro Florence, SC

    Title should be changed: "Why does Xojo Inc. firewall acts like this?"

  20. Dave S

    19 Dec 2016 San Diego, California USA

    @ÜllarKruustik @Michel: Sorry to hear that. What happened with natural born discussion via little disagreement?.

    Big difference between a "natural born discussion" and a mindless rant.

    While a "few" others have indicated similar problems to yours, the vast majority of us have no problems what so ever. And using my skills as a computer systems developer... When 99% of users are fine, and 1% are not, then you look at what the 1% have or are doing differently than the other 99%, and in most cases rule out all commonality (ie. we all have this forum in common) which indicates to ME that it is not the forum at fault.

    So what is different? (these are assumptions at this point)

    • you are on a different network path between you and the Xojo Servers
    • you are in a foriegn country (in relation to the Xojo Servers), and you country may (or may not) impose some level of restrictions (remember I said "assumptions")
    • there may be an issue with how your ISP routes the traffic to you
    • your personal internet modem or router may not be configured in an optimum manner

    I'm NOT saying any of these are or are not true, I'm just listing them as possible explanations (amongst a 100 others)

    There is A LOT between your computer and the Xojo Servers.....

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