Can you make 'Pretty' websites with Xojo?

Can you make “Pretty” and “Fancy” webpages in Xojo??
Thank you all in advance for any insights here.

I have a couple of sites to make and the work came via an advertising agency so I can expect all sorts of fun requirements.
Im pretty well versed in the code of xojo and business apps.
I use custom web containers a lot and I “think” I could replicate most “Fancy” and “Pretty” webpages BUT…

I haven’t actually tried yet and Im wondering if any of you have gone down this path before??

I could use CSS and html and build them from scratch but I really love working in Xojo.

So are there any gotchas in Xojo for making things look good?

Plus Im not adverse to buying 3rd party controls plugins etc

Thanks a million for any insights

Well, Xojo makes web apps not web sites. The basic UI isn’t very configurable so if your clients wants to change the way something looks, like say the Toolbar, or popup menus, you might be out of luck with native Xojo.

Ho Bob
Thanks for your input
Ive played a lot with web containers and I think I could build replacements for these things. Im not sure.

Im sort of basing my thinking that all websites these days are really web apps.

And are really just the fancy front end to the business system that lies underneath. i.e. display the products on the consumer website, by linking into the backend inventory system etc.

I know this is a how long is a piece of string question, but…
Do you think web containers are flexible enough to reproduce website effects?

Not really. I think you’ll cause yourself some serious pain.

cheers
Thanks for that

I went through this ordeal thinking I could replace a ton of HTML with a single web app, but some research and solid advice convinced me that you need a high degree of HTML content for your site to be visible on the WWW. Because the web crawler robots can’t index or use the contents of an executable, the site or app you have constructed with Xojo will gradually drop off the main search indexes and your site will slowly become invisible. Having said all of that, I have found Xojo’s web app designer/creator very useful in creating specialised functions that would normally involve one being a Java guru. I speak of functions such as web Ecommerce shopping carts and checkout.

There seems to be some movement on this with Release 3. Nothing definitive yet but it seems like this problem is being solved.

Even if the web app becomes technically indexable, the very nature of a web app makes it a lot less relevant than the simplest of HTML pages crammed with content. Ralf Van de Ven has implemented a very valid solution to have an app indexed, though : https://forum.xojo.com/15323-hashtag-in-allowunsupportedbrowser

But I feel that the best of both worlds is to have a sexy interface using HTM, CSS and whatever technologies that render well and index well, plus Xojo app(s) for engineering.

Think of a WebApp built with Xojo as really a desktop app but with a Browser based UI. It’s not quite like that but if you think that way, then it will help you understand the difference between a web site and a web app. Many times you might want to use both of them. Maybe have the web site be the HTML side of things that can be indexed but call up the web app from that site. So it’s really going to be a mix of the two.

I’d like to see some live (pretty) websites that are made with xojo.
So if you have links…

Hi Jukka,
can you describe what you consider to be “pretty” ?
It is only related to the graphics part or functional or whatever?

Regards.

Visually appealing, not just desktop app in browser.

See https://forum.xojo.com/10065-any-live-web-projects-out-there
Guy Rabiller presented a very attractive site made with Xojo.

Most of the time, to get to a real nice result, though, either some measure of JavaScript, or an HTML/CSS front is necessary.

Maybe another idea …

I think I read (but never tried it) that a XOJO Web App will run in a frame in a “traditional” HTML Website. If so you could do the visual work in a different tool then embed the XOJO piece on the page in a frame. It might make you break up the XOJO UI to work a little differently depending on your needs.

Can anybody confirm if this will work?

Thanks.

[quote=140273:@Mark Strickland]
I think I read (but never tried it) that a XOJO Web App will run in a frame in a “traditional” HTML Website. If so you could do the visual work in a different tool then embed the XOJO piece on the page in a frame. It might make you break up the XOJO UI to work a little differently depending on your needs.

Can anybody confirm if this will work?[/quote]

Yes, it does work quite fine. Except for 2014R1 and maybe 214R2 which do not run in iFrames. All other versions including 2014R2.1 do.

[quote=140123:@Jukka Leino]I’d like to see some live (pretty) websites that are made with xojo.
So if you have links…[/quote]
Not a “site” but out internal app for contacts and such. Far from done and the GUI is not set in stone yet.

HTML5 combined with CSS3 is the only route to go here. You can use DreamWeaver if you choose the visual way or CSE HTML validator or TopStyle 5 if you choose for the manual way (the last one is the best).

Use the correct tool for the job. When I read the comments here, it seems that Xojo is the best allround tool developed ever. But it isn’t. For website creation it is a very poor solution, performing evenly more poorer with shared hosting. Sorry to burst your buble

HTML5 together with CSS3 is the right way to go. Sorry Xojo fans!

[quote=140498:@Chris Verberne]HTML5 combined with CSS3 is the only route to go here. You can use DreamWeaver if you choose the visual way or CSE HTML validator or TopStyle 5 if you choose for the manual way (the last one is the best).

Use the correct tool for the job. When I read the comments here, it seems that Xojo is the best allround tool developed ever. But it isn’t. For website creation it is a very poor solution, performing evenly more poorer with shared hosting. Sorry to burst your buble

HTML5 together with CSS3 is the right way to go. Sorry Xojo fans![/quote]

You may not have read carefully enough. I keep saying that in another form, since a Xojo app in an iFrame is a valid way to access a database or other features requiring complex computing that HTML5 and CSS cannot do by themselves.

I have also several times explained that although Xojo apps can be indexed with some doing, their intrinsic nature does not comply to what is required to get a decent ranking in search engines. So anybody thinking “site” better rest his domain on serious HTML, and use Xojo Web apps only where they are required.

Reading your post, it feels as if you think in binary terms (either/or) that appear awfully prejudiced against Xojo. Is it not possible to take the best out of every technology ? Most HTML sites, by the way, use some sort of programming language in addition to HTML5 and CSS, would that be PHP, Perl, JavaScript or something else. Why not Xojo, then ?

Incidentally, the site from Guy Rabiller I mentioned also uses CSS and HTML5 together with Xojo.

Thoughts like Chris Verberne’s arise because people think inside a box. The box is that if you have a tool to create a web app then you have a tool to create a website. WRONG. A web app is NOT a website. Xojo is NOT a tool for creating websites and anyone who thinks it is for that is seriously thinking inside a box that is very limiting. Xojo is a tool that is used to create web apps - it’s to do extra things beyond what is easily accomplished with just HTML and so forth.

People think in boxes. They think Web App = Web Site.

I have a Web App I created and sell. It’s not a web site. It’s an app. It mimics my desktop app as much as possible except that the UI is in the browser. My app runs in a standalone and has a bunch of additional features you can access with it that have nothing to do with a web page.

You use the tool needed for the job.

But when the only tool you have is a hammer, everything is a nail.

Isn’t that exactly what Chris said? Xojo = Web App <> Web Site